Is MINI nearing the end ?
 

Not so positive news that MINI is nearing the end even if its plans include SUV type autos in the future.

Well I guess that's good news for those of us that are MINI owners.

Maybe now its value may increase ?

Who told you this?

I'm a 2019 MINI owner and just received a ridiculously gigantic MaritzCZX Customer Study survey. (I already received a couple small ones from MINI). It makes me think they are losing their car brand and at least trying to figure out why. There are so many questions I'm thinking about not bothering. I just want to tell them maybe your peak sales years were because it used to be a small, iconically designed car. My two sisters love small cars and I upgraded from a 2008 Cooper S to a 2019 JCW and it feels bigger and heavier, because it is. They noticed it's getting bigger too, enough that they would not consider buying one.

Small cars are a struggling these days, but I think if MINI stayed cute and small, maybe It'd be a different sales story for them. Maybe not.

Agreed. I've driven a couple gen 3 Minis and while I felt that they were very nice alternative BMWs, they didn't have the same soul as our R56. Size and weight really factors into that.

I know that it's partially due to US safety regulations getting harder and harder each year, but if Mazda can reduce the weight and footprint of the MX-5 and still comply, then MINIs deserve to stay mini.

What I hear from around here and Motoringfile is that the true Gen4 Mini will be the electric. It'll be about 3,000 lbs. The Gen1 Minis were about 2,500 and my Gen2 Coupe is about 2,650. But it'll be 2 doors and smaller, like the Gen1 and Gen2 cars. No noise. No exhaust. Very responsive acceleration. Wheels on the corners handling. 4 wheel drive. The MF article said it should be the best Mini ever for Autocross courses. Not sure that the means for the gasoline powered Minis, whether there will be a Gen4 version of them or not. They weigh about 3,500 lbs.

In 2002 when the Mini came to the US everyone had and wanted SUV’s but Mini did very well. It was small quirkier and fun to drive. They sold like hot cakes. Even the interior was different. The switches were in the middle along with the big speedo. It was different and fun.
I remember the initial JD Power survey were low with owners but when they would survey the owners after they had the car for a while it was high. This was because it took time for some people to get the quirkiness of the car. BMW chased after the initial satisfaction and lost their way.
The gen3 Minis are very nice cars I am referring to the F56 and F57. The rest are not true to what Mini is all about.

When you run a add campaign “the biggest Mini ever” you obviously have lost your way and don’t understand your market.

The electric Mini is not going to save them

But I could be out to lunch

I haven't read anything about AWD EVs. That would be nice, considering we only have a Paceman because the Hardtop doesn't get All4. From what I've read the "best autoX car" statements revolve around the trick stability control that electric motors enable. In other words, it's going to be a crutch that won't force me to grow as a driver. Yawn... At least it will be good in the snow.

Fixed that for you. ;]

But seriously, I can't remember the last time I got excited about a BMW that wasn't a MINI.

"Ultimate Driving Machine" warped into "Ultimate status symbol for those with no creativity".... Eh... that's pretty wordy, I see why they haven't changed yet.

I am holding on to my R53 as it may become a collectors item.

With under 50 K miles maybe its value is now increasing instead of dropping.

On that note, I should buy two R53s while they are cheap and easy to find. One to store in a bubble and one to drive! >=]

Come to think of it... I should grab a 3rd for parts. Still cheaper than a farkled F56!

I don't know guys. I think "The End of MINI!" is pretty click-baity sensationalism. Fact of the matter is, sales aren't that bad, they just aren't making the same kind of cars as they were 15 years ago. I'm much more worried about FIAT leaving the states again. =/ Anxious to see the revamped 500e. Will it actually turn a profit this time around?

I bet the MINI is a very expensive car to manufacture, so if they aren't making the same ROI as other cars, they won't keep making MINIs. Would you?

I hope BMW is reading and listening to us here on NAM:

Go back, make it small like it used to be, a MINI.

To my mind, they've done quite a few things right since 2002, but they lost the plot on styling and never really turned the corner on reliability/serviceability issues.

- Mark

The chubby rear of the gen3 Justa has grown on me but even the gen 2 JCW kit was way too fake-venty and aggressive for my liking. Peak MINI styling was the GP1 in my book.

Oddly enough, I really like the roundy nose on the Clubman, I think it fits the wagon, but it's my least favorite part of the Hardtop styling.

I’ve driven all three generations, I started with a Gen 3 and when I returned to the dealer I said “this wasn’t what I was expecting”. It was soft, a bit mushy and the steering and shifter were both very vague. Sales lady said try a Gen 2, which was definitely better but still not great. Bought a Gen 1 JCW a few months ago and it’s exactly what I expect from MINI.

Hopefully they figure it out and can make the effort to bring back the light weight fun and analog they had in the Gen 1.

Just like every other automobile manufacturer, they have to keep changing it and making it a little bigger ( for what reason ) ?

Should have left it small like the original Mini was for many many years.

Increasingly demanding crash safety standards most likely. My wife's first MINI (R56) was shockingly cheap to insure compared to her VW due to all of the safety features they had crammed into it.

The weight of emissions controls and tech certainly aren't negligible either. I used to think my FIAT was a very basic car, but even that has over a dozen computers monitoring various things and talking to each other. They may not be big, but every chip and wire adds weight and it starts to add up.

But when it’s engineered so nearly all that weight is evenly distributed in the floorplan, it’s a very different car that should have fantastic cornering because of its very low center of gravity and perfect weight distribution.

The center of gravity is low in my motorcycle, doesn't mean it's magically agile. There is a wide gulf between "feels lighter than it is" and "actually light".

My bio-dyno knows the difference between a ton of torque compensating for a heavy car and a well balanced sporty car. I haven't driven any performance oriented EVs yet, so I am simply an unfounded skeptic. I would be very happy be proven wrong.

I think the Cooper SE is a stopgap solution anyway. They are launching it to get some good real world experience while they work on the actually competitive, full range of EV MINIs.

I can't believe that MINI is sending out surveys because they are clueless as to what is wrong. What's wrong, as been already stated here, is that MINI's aren't mini anymore. I like to joke that the next MINI Cooper Hardtop re-design, will share a chassis with a Series 7.

My feelings are based on that MINI should complement BMW. MINI should have all the small models, and BMW have all the SUV's and McLimos.

I don't know how it is elsewhere, but here the MINI dealer is next door to the BMW dealer. And when I drop my MINI off for service, they actually just drive it over to the BMW service area (the MINI dealer itself has no service bays).

I don’t understand why any of those things matter to you. As long as they have a model which offers you the features you want at the right price with the right reliability, who cares if they also build buses or airplanes?

Mini has to share it’s platform with another car maker, it’s as simple as that. If not BMW, only Toyota would be as good, at least for reliability.

Personally, I think their JCW models are too expensive and BMW doesn’t have great reliability or repairability. As an example, our new Countryman has an electric parking brake. Who knows why, but I took a look at the brakes, and they implemented it with an actuator that’s bolted to the brake caliper and encased in plastic. I just don’t know what to say about housing brake components in plastic, right at the wheel. It seems like they engineer these cars to get through their lease period and die. But now I own this and a BMW 435, so I’m fairly committed to repairing them on my own.

That's the point. MINI doesn't have a model I really desire. My new F56 is way too much larger than my old R50, and MINI doesn't make any vehicle the same size as my old R50.

As I said, MINI isn't mini anymore. MINI has lost its way. And if they can't figure that out, a survey isn't going to help them in the least.

It would be like Toyota changing their Prius to be a V8 powered supercar, that gets 6mpg, and then scratching their heads in wonder as to why their old loyal customers aren't buying it.

The answer isn't as simple as Mini just needing to go back and build only small cars again. The world has changed and SUV/crossovers have taken over. Any car builder would be a fool to ignore this trend and just continue building coupes and sedans. To compete, you have to produce what people want, not what they used to want.

As an example of things done more/less right, look at Porsche. At the time when the new Mini first shipped, they basically had two small sports car models - the 911 and Boxster. Since then, they've enhanced these cars and expanded with the four-door Panamera and two SUVs - the Cayenne and the Macan. All their lines have lots of variants that are compeling in different ways. When the Porsche SUVs started shipping, many predicted this would be the end of Porsche, but they've sold exceptionally well, easily outselling the sports cars, and they're considered excellent cars in their segments. The Panamera, Cayenne, and Macan are generally regarded as very nicely styled cars which keep the sportiness of a Porsche but are much more usable and practical. And customer satisfaction, dealer service, and overall reliability have made major strides - Porsche is now consistently near the top on most surveys. Mini has tried to do the same thing, but the execution has been badly flawed with wacky styling, indifferent customer support, and cars that, if anything, have become more troublesome over time.

I don't see Mini's strategy as that flawed; they've just screwed the pooch with poor execution.

- Mark

Older used Mini's here are very inexpensive. Granted I suspect it's due to a lot of comments about cost of repairs and known issues. I don't think Mini is the only marque that is pulling back from the market. If you own a smart Fortwo you probably feel like an orphan right now as Mercedes has already pulled the plug on ICE smarts and is about to completely exit the North American market.

That doesn't mean the smart is dead (just sleeping...) though it is here, while in Europe where it is built it may still be hanging on with life support.

It seems many European countries are pushing for EV only vehicles in the future so car makers based there are more apt to start gearing up for that market. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phase-..._fuel_vehicles

Thing is over there folks don't drive the great distances that we do over here and so EV's aren't as restrictive as they tend to be here. Plus a lack of infrastructure makes things worse, here in Toronto though most times the Tesla supercharger stations I pass are empty.

I read the comment about coal fired generating and agree, seems insane. Granted diesel powered charging stations also make me wonder.... places with a high percentage of renewable power generation then yes EV makes sense as you climate is severely screwed up.

I believe BMW lost their way as well, and the last car they've produced that piqued my interest was the R56. Everything else might as well be scrapped. I like the idea of smaller cars and I hope they'll go that route. Take those "F- cars and rebate them under BMW. They aren't Minis in my humble opinion. Thanks and Cheers