Well that is certainly your prerogative, but the fact is with Dinan you are getting an “insurance” policy in many respects in the event something happens you are covered - it’s worth it to many people !!

 

People have to determine their own value prop vs cost ratio. I am delighted with the Elite and would buy it again in a heartbeat. Of course, I am a whacko that just paid over $1000 for an iPhone X so my value vs cost ratio may be a bit twisted!

 

It isn't a prerogative, it is perspective based on an economic comparison. As for an "insurance policy," in the F150 world, where the engines and vehicles are FAR more expensive than this world, there are tuners who offer flat out warrantys, again, for a fraction of the 899 price tag.

My JCW needs a kick in the tail as it just does not have the performance needed to be the sports car it ought to be. Frankly, the JCW ought to have an M-Power engine as it is MINIs (BMWs) performance car! But, it doesn't.

The Dinan Elite tune is a comparative rip off, plain and simple. That does not mean I would never purchase it (I resisted the iPhone X so far lol) but it is calling something out for the reality that envelopes it. I'd hope that is an OK thing to do.

Hopefully there will be more cost effective and truly custom tuning available in the near future!

 

BMW is the "parent" company of MINI, why would they put out a car that out performs BMW. A stock MINI will always come slower than a stock BMW. Same goes with Audi and Volkswagen. Comparing the similar models side by side. The parent company will almost always win.

Honestly, you never should of bought a Countryman if you want speed IMO.

 

What I am looking for is performance as others clearly are because they bought a performance device! I just don't want to pay $900 which is a comparative rip off. Not even diesel tunes are that much and they are under fire from the EPA and risking huge fines.

As for the M Power, I am not sure I understand. There are plenty of BMW performance cars that will always out run a MINI - even with an M engine. And, BMW could de-tune the engine so that it would not compete directly, but still give the performance that a JCW ought to have, IMO. JCW is MINIs performance car! 0-60 in nearly 6 seconds in 2017 is pretty poor. lol. In any case, I love our 2(!) MINIs and will likely skip the Dinan option with the hope that an actual tuner will open the strategy and get solid, reliable gains from the 2.0 power-plant.

My intent was not to cause hurt feelings.... back to your normally scheduled program!

 

No hurt feelings here - odd to imply however that Dinan isn’t a real tuner ? Their products have always been of top quality and certainly they can “tune “ a car . Certainly if $900 is too much for piece of mind should anything happen with your car then so be it , but for a lot of people it isn’t and especially for those with a new car it’s a good option . Different strokes for different folks

 

Yep, no hurt feeling here. I just don't think I would have bought a JCW countryman for a "fast performance" car. Yes, it's fun and quick in the turns, but it's still a crossover mini suv. It wasn't made for "Fast".

 

There are a number of issues here. First, you cannot really compare the F150 world to that of the Mini, or even Mini and BMW combined. The sheer volume of F150's alone outnumbers BMW and Mini combined. So you have economies of scale, and potential customers. You can sell something for less, while generating far more revenue when you have a much larger potential customer base.

Second, what you described is the Tuner offer a warranty, which is great, assuming said tuner does not go out of business, or turns into an ******* and finds a way to deny coverage, just like all those third party warranties out there do. Then you have your regular vehicle warranty to worry about, you might have a problem with X, and the dealer will deny your warranty claim because you have a tune, and it is on you to prove that the tune was not the reason for issue X (although in some states the laws state that dealers have to prove that in the event of a warranty denial). It might provide peace of mind on paper, but when it comes time to make a claim for a blown engine, I would like to see how far you would get.

With DINAN, you have an intact factory warranty, no arguing over whether a tune caused a problem when you bring the vehicle in, no questions asked.

Also, you are arguing over $900... you want to complain, how about the tune for my old Mercedes AMG C63, which (they are cheaper now) at the time I was looking into it, was around $3500, and you know what it did, it simply remapped and removed the detuning that Mercedes implemented in the C63 models to avoid cannibalizing E63 sales (The engines, transmission, etc are identical, but the C63 was around 450HP, the E63 at 505HP.. if memory serves me, but there was essentially around a 50 to 75HP difference, that is it).

 

So... LOL... the Dinan Elite tune - that is a complete reflash correct? Not a plug and play piggyback? I'm assuming I'll have to find a Dinan tuner in the area?

And no - we didn't buy a Countryman for speed LOL. It's a heavy pig - AWD - 4 cyl. It will never be "fast" - but it can be fun never the less. A bit more TQ will help which is why I tune. I also know these cars always come from factory way under tuned and a little bump will not hurt anything...

 

I'm pretty sure it is a plug n play piggyback system.

 

It's a plug in.

Here's the install instructions: http://files.dinancars.com/webresour...08293296e9.pdf

 

It is not even close to a flash. It is a simple piggyback that causes the ecu to see a low boost condition and then maps additional fuel and timing to the "compensated" boost. All for the low, low price of 900.

THAT is the LOL.

It just makes sense to steer clear of the concept of performance. This is a 5-door hatch that has so much potential yet is stupidly under-powered and neutered from the factory. I get this site (or sub-forum) is not a performance-minded culture, but the JCW engine has the potential to be truly track capable as the car is billed by none other than MINI. And, for a 900 price tag, a true ecu rewrite with lifetime custom revisions is STILL too expensive.

Again, LOL!

 

Ah - thought the ELITE was a true tune. So what's the difference between the Elite and the Sport? Is it simply that the Sport is +30HP/40TQ and the Elite gets you double at +58HP/88TQ? Or are there other differences?

I'm not sure if I'm interested in a piggyback tune. I'll need to do more research... I've gotten a lot of mixed arguments. I've always had true tunes on my cars...

BTW - the stage 1 tune on my S4 was $1500 (I'm stage 2 so quite a bit more than that)... The custom tune on my S2000 will cost me about $1k in the spring. $900 for 60hp and almost 90TQ is not all that bad given you can self install. Heck, I just spent $700 on clearbra which doesn't do anything for performance at all... LOL... I think you can still get a stage 1 APR tune for a GTI in the $600 range. but then you have to pay a shop 1 hour labor to flash your ECU.

Have there been other tuners out there providing off the shelf options for the mini? I know the whole tuning industry is getting harder and harder because manufactures are locking down ECU's more and more.

 

I did get a response from a local shop here on the difference for those like me who are a bit confused still...

The Elite tuner $899 is a little more sophisticated as it modifies a few more signals, takes a little more to install and generates a little more power (51hp and 75lbs trq)and also comes with a more robust manufacture matching warranty.
https://www.dinancars.com/product/d4...?series=&mid=/


The Sport tuner $299 is a little simpler to install as it modifies only 1 or 2 signals and generates a little less power (30hp and 40lbs trq) and only come with a product warranty on itself.
https://www.dinancars.com/product/d4...?series=&mid=/

 

I got a similar vague response, so I called Dinan directly.

When it comes to tuning, I want to know exactly what is going on and also what I ought to step up maintenance-wise to ensure longevity with the increased mechanical cycles.

Wow, that is nuts. I have a current set of truly custom tunes (sent a base tune and revised through data logging) that are adjusting parameters at the cylinder level and remap the transmission, too! They cost me all of 350 for my truck.

I have talked to a few people that said for a tune, you have to go digging. I will call Helix tomorrow as a start...

 

Weird, my comment from earlier never showed (got a weird awaiting moderation message....)

The major difference is economy of scale and factory warranty support. you cannot compare the F150 crowd to the BMW and Mini crowd combined. There are more F150s out there then all BMW and Mini vehicles combined. So a tune will more than likely be purchased far more often (the cost of a product is not just the material and lines of code, there is marketing, research costs, and what not) than the Dinan ones.

You mentioned earlier that you can get aftermarket tunes, and they offer a warranty, that is nice and all when there is a problem with the tune, but take your F150 in for a warranty repair because your radio is not working, and watch your dealer deny the warranty because you have a tuned vehicle. That is illegal of course, but have fun proving that (in some states, for a warranty claim denial the dealer actually has to prove that the modification was the cause).

With the Dinan, you have full factory support, meaning no matter what happens they will honor your warranty.

Also, I would not complain too much, $900 is not exactly that pricey. If you want expensive (and an insult on top of that), some Mercedes tuners charge $2500 and up to just restore the C63 performance to full factory spec. The C63 has a detuned M156 and associated transmission, identical to what is in the E63, yes was about 80 HP and 100lb of twist less. The tune just restored that.

 

I'm assuming you didn't test drive your car before buying it? Because if you did, you would have known how under powered it feels/drives. Are you butt hurt you spent over $40K on a JCW when you could of got way more horsepower/speed out of a whole hell of a lot more cars for that price.

 

I was a little butthurt when my wife made me trade my 09 C63 in for the 17 Clubman S ALL4.. then I remembered the $20k quote I got to work on my transmission (I put 120k drive it like I stole it miles on it). it lessened the butthurt quite significantly

 

I have the exact car that I want. In fact, I ordered it to be exactly what I want.

At this point, I am starting to work on the customization that will make the car perform as I want. I am not sure why you have an issue with this? It is my car and my choices for my car.

Why this causes you heartburn is just baffling. Is it because you spent a stupid amount of money on a device that should have cost at most in the 300 range? Hey, it's your money!

 

I would like to politely request that this thread return to a productive discussion instead of just bickering. Everybody can have a point of view without negativity.

Many thanks!

 

 

.

 

I'm done.

 

So my dealer said that if he saw the Dinan on the car, he would 'flag' the vehicle to BMW/MINI and would not service the car if there were any engine issues. Given that the Elite comes with a full warranty, how many of you still install anyways (regardless of this warning from the dealer)?

I'm not exactly the 'mechanic' type so wouldn't trust myself to install / uninstall every time it goes in for service.

Not sure what to do...

 

Darn, that stinks. Is there another dealer anywhere near you?

You do not have to be a mechanic to install/uninstall this device. It is literally 3 plugs (well 6 really - 3 into the car and 3 removed from the car into the leads to the device.) The plugs will match only where they go so you cannot mix them up. It would take longer to allow the car to go to sleep - which is a matter of just sitting and waiting for the lights to go off. I would think the pain would be in mounting/ dismounting the device each time.

I understand that Dinan has the warranty and some might trust it implicitly, but I don't and would not... that is just me. I think what Dinan are counting on is that the B48 engine is reliable and their maps are no where near tolerance limits for the operation of the engine. It is a significantly de-tuned power plant.

http://files.dinancars.com/webresour...bbef9698c1.pdf