They're already electric. They just use a diesel generator instead of batteries.

 

Total lie.
For starters, nickel and iron are the two main ingredients of steel. Every car is made of steel. EV batteries aren’t a cause of environmental pollution, and the Subury mine was cleaned up decades ago.

 

That is patently false and I’ll mail you $100 USD if you can prove it.

The battery in a Prius is made of metal. All cars are made of metal. The gross curb weight of a Prius is 3,000 pounds. That’s a direct reflection of the metal content. A Mini Cooper, which we all know is one of the smallest cars made, weighs 2,600 to 3,000 pounds as well. A ford Excursion weighs about 7,000 pounds.

Are you seriously going to tell me that 3,000 pounds of metal has a greater environmental cost than 7,000 pounds of metal?

Adding to this, the Prius legitimately consumes 40-50 mpg ACTUAL. The Mini about 30-33, and that Ford about 17 mpg.

And then theres longevity. The Prius is likely the lowest maintenance, longest-lasting passenger vehicles sold today. It’s used by taxi fleets where they routinely hit the 300,000 mile maximum without major repair. And if you compare the resale value of Prius to Mini, you’ll see that the market values this reliability. A longer-lasting vehicle, particularly one with low fuel consumption and low emissions, has a vastly lower environmental cost that a gas-guzzling vehicle which lasts only 100-150K miles.

Now then, are you sure you can take that $100 from me?

 

How come when you get behind someone driving a Prius you know its going to be a drive at least 5mph under the speed limit?

Ban the Prius!

 

Yep. IMO the most boring, soul-sucking vehicle since the Ford Pinto.

 

Nickel is mainly used in STAINLESS steel and not a major metal in steel for autos. Carbon and manganese are the major elements. The alloy depends where it is used on the car (strength, wear, memory). Most steel in autos is actually recycled (from car crushers). Most steel recycled US goes to Mexico for processing. Nickel is (was) used in the chrome plating process.


Lithium batteries were thought to be the answer but, obviously, they have problems bursting into flames.


Why are you driving a MINI if you love the Prius? Just curious.

 

So they cleaned it up by building the world's second tallest smoke stack. At 1250' that is like an 80 story building. Guess the solution to pollution is dilution.

As far as lithium goes, it's also good to have something in your car that when introduced to water burns.

 

You can see the smoke stack in Sudbury on Google Earth. I think they put a star on it so Santa does not get lost.

 

Back in the day I was a LEED AP, know a little bit about building an eco-friendly facility. Many of the techniques were just good common sense. Others, like shipping bamboo flooring from Asia were not IMO. To get Gold or Platinum status it requires allot of money, something the majority of folks don't have.

As far as a Prius being a dirty car, there are numerous articles on both side of the fence on whether it is or whether it is not. Going to move this thread to the Off Topic area, there is some very good discussions on both side. So we will all just have to read about it there, that is unless you are going to go "off the grid" and either live in a cave or a wood shack as Ted Kaczynski did.

 

I have a Prius with six years and 120,000 miles which has never required any repair whatsoever. Boring, but awfully reliable. And I have that commuter lane sticker, which lets me pass Minis and Porsche’s every morning.

I thought about buying a Mini, but they’re just too small, so I bought a BMW 4-series. So now I have a fun car to complement my practical car.

My GF’s Mini had a radiator fan that wouldn’t run at low speed, and I had to take the whole front end off the car to replace the failed resistor. And it has a host of other problems for me to fix, like an engine mount or two in need of replacement. So they definitely aren’t built as well as Toyota’s, but she loved her father dearly and inherited the car from him, so I do all I can to put that car in perfect condition.

 

A MINI is a BMW and if you ever have to work on the BMW you will understand the joy of 6 lbs of crap in a 5 lb bucket.

Yes the Japanese vehicles are well engineered but why are the Japanese cars engineered and manufactured so well?

 

I guess you takes yer enjoyment where you find it. I think the closest commuter lane is about 150 miles from me. Think that's more of a metropolitan critter.

Nice of you to help with your GF's car. Her Dad obviously had good taste, and I'm sure he, like the majority of us, bought a Mini not for Toyota like reliability, but because they're so damned much fun. Most of us know going in that it's gonna take a little more commitment than adding gas occasionally. YMMV

 

Until one has driven a road as the Tale of Dragon, where a MINI in stock form will give a BMW a very good run for its money (perhaps even run over it), IMO the term "fun" needs to be held in reserve. Of course just my opinion.

 

Well, that's fine now, but what about when you come back in your next life?
Trans-gender, Soylent Green eating, Agenda 21 embracing, New World Order drone!

 

OK, dated yourself for sure, The Time Machine with Rod Taylor. You think Weena was there when he went back??

Now that you opened the door, went to my grandson's basketball game yesterday, he is eight. Lets just say I saw a few double dribbles and traveling (like half the court). Well the score keeper was most likely some high school kid that was volunteering. His score keeping was about as good as the 8-year-olds playing. One parent got on him for taking a point away. Shouting was taking place across the gym and the kid said "I am a person, you are hurting my feelings."

No matter how much humans socially progress, until there is ability to modify the brain at the chemical level, there are always going to be a Hitler, a Sadaam Husein, a Jeffery Dahmer or a Kim Jong-un. Until that time, thank god for those that put their lives on the line for others.

 

First, I just want to say that an electric Mini Cooper can be an awesome car, and second, I’m not at all into this “My car’s great/your car stinks” talk. I love cars, and I am truly amazed at the reliability of Prius.

My BMW has 20,000 miles and the right rear turn signal/brake light failed. Turns out the ground pin connection too thin, and it gradually shorted and burned. This was a problem in my 1996 BMW, and it was the subject of recalls in previous models... so it’s not simply a case of BMW cars failing because of higher performance design... this is just a brake light. And in the Mini Cooper, the fan resistors failed in most of the cars produced. Theres no reason for that except for sub-par engineering.

That said, I’ve been repairing my own cars for thirty years, so it wasn’t a problem to pull the front end off of the Mini or to solder a thicker ground wire which bypassed the poorly designed (and burnt) connector in the tail light housing. You should see my Prius... 120,000 miles, and every inch looks like a showroom-fresh car.

I like the little red Mini S convertible, and I’m going to gradually restore it. My next project is replacing the engine mounts, then I’ll probably reupholster.

 

Loosen up a little, for God's sack this is an autoforum. Nobody is going to save the world or most likely change anybody's mind here.

 

I am so impressed with your confidence regarding facts and the strident manner in which you assert your position.

I stand by my statement that the Prius is one of the dirtiest cars when the batteries are factored in.

If you have hard data to disprove this, I am willing to modify my position.

The vigor of your assertions, while impressive, offers little to substantiate your position.

I think, in fairness, the jury is still out regarding the total and cumulative long term environmental impact of current hybrid vehicles. We do know, for certain, that current technologies employed to mine and process the metals required for hybrids is neither clean nor efficient in the aggregate. It requires mining, smelting, lots of transporting, and disposal has yet to be optimized.

I think the following fair-minded and balanced article on this subject, though the focus is mostly on Tesla, is a good starting point:

https://www.wired.com/2016/03/teslas...t-green-think/

It has also been my experience that demanding facts, with the underlying assumption that there is some uncontestable veracity in what some have determined to be facts, is risky. But then, I live with a philosopher who encourages me to be dubious of assertions, especially when the assertions are mine.

I hope we can agree, that while the future may be electric cars, the Prius, noble a start as it represents, with its combination of internal combustion and rare earth batteries, and with all that is required to build, transport and recycle each car, isn't the final answer.

 

In California and other CARB states, hybrid and electric vehicles are required by law to have a 10-year, 150,000 mile warranty on the EV and hybrid systems of the car, including the battery.

After that point, I know that with Prius, at least, there are firms which test the failed batteries, replace the failed cells, rebalance the pack and sell it as refurbished.

 

I’d be happy to disprove that, and it’s quite easy. When you read the Wired article you cited, it contains no actual facts, except for a link to a report by the Union of Concerned Scientists. Here’s what the Wired article says about the UCS article:
“In fact, manufacturing an electric vehicle generates more carbon emissions than building a conventional car, mostly because of its battery, the Union of Concerned Scientists has found.”

WOW!!!
But then click on the link and read the UCS article, which begins with this:
“But what are the global warming emissions of electric cars on a life cycle basis—from the manufacturing of the vehicle’s body and battery to its ultimate disposal and reuse? To answer this, the Union of Concerned Scientists undertook a comprehensive, two-year review of the climate emissions from vehicle production, operation, and disposal. We found that battery electric cars generate half the emissions of the average comparable gasoline car, even when pollution from battery manufacturing is accounted for.”

So, I’m afraid there’s no $100 there, wouldn’t you agree?

 

Ok, lets clean this thread up.

 

In 2003, I got to drive the Tzero built by AC propulsion with one of the founders of Tesla (before that Elon guy). Ever accelerate so fast that your peripheral vision was just a blur and it reminded you of the Enterprise going to warp 9?

I have more than once stayed up very late drinking excellent red wine with the other founder of Tesla (before that Elon guy), a fellow engineer, talking engineering, cars, batteries, and power density.

Do a google search for Wrightspeed X1, the guy who built it used to live across the street from me. He gave me a ride 0-100-0, simply amazing.

I have driven the Tesla roadster and the Model S P90D in "insane" mode. And I know and occasionally fly with those guys who fly into the Harris Ranch. I guess I live in the right neighborhood, though I can't afford a Tesla.

As an engineer, believe me, the electric car is going to take over faster than you think. Until we discover di-lithium crystals there will always be a place for fossil fuels (jet airplanes) but terrestrial transportation is going electric, it is so much more efficient and simple that it is inevitable. Electric cars have their own set of problems but they are going to save the planet. My commute is about 25 miles each way, so an electric car of even modest range would do just fine for my daily needs. As soon as there's one that is 1) affordable, 2) fun to drive, 3) not butt-ugly, there will be one in my garage. Tesla Model 3 maybe.

I will keep my MINI for weekends, because while electric cars can have stupid levels of acceleration, there's just no replacement for the fun of coordinating hands and feet to execute perfect heel-toe downshifts through a fun set of corners.

 

Didn't you know that the name "Prius" is derived from the Japanese word that loosely translates as "you must pass me on the right."

OK I made that up. Here in Norcal the Prius drivers are either 5 under or 15 over the limit.

 

True, the body contains little nickel, but there are many parts in a car which use hardened and/or stainless steel, especially exhaust components and engine/transmission gears:
https://www.nickelinstitute.org/Nick...lications.aspx

 

The Japanese road system is right hand drive, so you drive on the left side of the road and the passing lane is the right lane.

But, yeah, there are a lot of really slow Prius drivers. I’m not one of them.