Head Work - Page 3 - North American Motoring

Drivetrain (Cooper S) MINI Cooper S (R53) intakes, exhausts, pulleys, headers, throttle bodies, and any other modifications to the Cooper S drivetrain.
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  #51  
Old 11-08-2018, 08:03 AM
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Originally Posted by cornjuice View Post
joke thread - read, no need

Nothing to see/hear except **** and vinegar. Was looking forward to seeing head work.. not just get your head 'worked' by troll posts. :( i digress.

Yes, there was some digression so lets get back to some head basics.

First, an engine brings air in and pushes it out, it’s a pump. The more air that can be processed the more power being generated. There are two types of engines, aspirated – bringing air in by the shear suction created by the rotating pistons/exhaust pressure, and forced induction – supercharger/turbocharged where the suction created by the pistons/exhaust is supplemented by a pump pushing/pressurizing the air.

The air that the engine processes is brought into and exhausted via openings on the front and back of the engine. These openings are called “ports.” The larger the ports, the more air processed. The size and shape of the port along with the smoothness or the port walls all affect airflow. In some instances, having a change in the shape of the port can impact air flow. These shape changes can either decrease or increase the velocity that the air can travel through the port. The finish of the port wall, roughness, also impacts velocity.

The intake manifold bolts to the engine allowing a pathway from the air filter into the engine. The exhaust manifold or header is also bolted to the engine and allows the exhaust gases to pass through the catalytic converter and then out the mufflers. If the engine head ports are enlarged than the ports on the intake and exhaust manifolds should match for the best performance. Thumper Performance, Way Motors and Sneed4Speed sell ported intake manifolds. Local area machine shops also may be able to perform the porting.

We move to the next step of the air process, the valves. Intake valves are normally larger than exhaust valves that you can see in the picture below from Way Motors. A valve is a doorway into the combustion chamber and the valve spring is what keeps that door closed. A valve has two parts, the stem and the head. The diameter of the stem and angle that the bottom of the head is shaped impacts the amount of air that can pass through the “door.” A lighter valve can have a smaller spring. These weight decreases means the engine requires less force to operate and results in a faster revving motor A valve can be made lighter by shortening the stem length and also by drilling out the center. Valve weight can also be affected by the metal alloy used. The alloy being used also affects the ability of the valve to handle the heat generated by the engine combustion cycle. Some valves are coated and some are drilled and filled with a different material all in an attempt to address either intake or exhaust impacts. Below are two informative articles on valves.

http://www.enginebuildermag.com/2006...rmance-valves/

http://www.sbintl.com/tech_library/a...and_alloys.pdf

The final piece of this process is the camshaft that was discussed in a previous post.

 
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Old 11-08-2018, 08:13 AM
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Next post will go into porting.
 
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Old 11-08-2018, 12:20 PM
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The Box of Chocolates
In a previous post Jan mentioned the quote by that famous fictional American Forrest Gump where he commented that his Mama told him life was like a box of chocolates and that you never knew what you were going to get. Well, that is somewhat applicable here but let me clarify things a little. First, Jan's RMW head being CNC is very precise so all the pieces of chocolate in his box are the same size, weight and all the same kind of filling. I actually prefer Haystacks. Now with a head machined by hand such as ThumperHeads or Way Motors the size of the chocolates may vary both in size and shape but they are still the same filling. Yes the sizes and weights may vary a little and if you are racing where tight tolerances make a difference then yes buy the RMW Chocolate Box. I am not looking to race and if my piece of candy is a little smaller or lighter than what the next person pick outs, I have no big issue. Plus my ThumperHeads Chocolate Box is cheaper so I can buy something else that is just as tasty such as jelly fruit slices.

So for "hand porting" here are a couple of videos reflecting some of the work involved.

Yes not Godiva but you might get a better understanding after watching.


The picture below is from one of my first posts here. Notice the blue/green color? Well in the second video you will see what it is for.




Oh and I am not going to be shouted down by a few vocal critics as I know there are those out there that find this thread informative.
 

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  #54  
Old 11-08-2018, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by ThumpR52 View Post
Why would I send you my TPR2 head that does not have the larger valves that match what is in the RMW head? I am not Mike Schultz aka Thumperheads and would not know him from Adam. I have only exchanged some emails with him. If you want a TPR2-R head, why don't you buy one from him?

Oh and do you know why Adam was called Adam?????????

My bad, with a name like the one you picked, I could easily confuse you for Mikey.

Comparing VANOS and a cam gear is laughable. Do they both adjust cam timing? Yes. Does one constantly adjust that timing, and the other is set it where its at and thats what you get? Yes. VANOS makes more power by adjusting cam timing, but it does it though the entire load/RPM range. It can also drop cam timing back to 0 at the upper RPM range when you don't need the cam advancement, and will make more power without it. VANOS is also going to adjust the only the cam side, or only the exhaust side where a gear is adjusting both the intake and exhaust.
 
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Old 11-08-2018, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by llabmik2 View Post
My bad, with a name like the one you picked, I could easily confuse you for Mikey.

Comparing VANOS and a cam gear is laughable. Do they both adjust cam timing? Yes. Does one constantly adjust that timing, and the other is set it where its at and thats what you get? Yes. VANOS makes more power by adjusting cam timing, but it does it though the entire load/RPM range. It can also drop cam timing back to 0 at the upper RPM range when you don't need the cam advancement, and will make more power without it. VANOS is also going to adjust the only the cam side, or only the exhaust side where a gear is adjusting both the intake and exhaust.
Laughable only to those that do understand that the basic motive and outcome is the same although the processes utilized to accomplish that outcome are vastly different as well as the number of possibilities.
 
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Old 11-08-2018, 04:43 PM
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It's not the same. A cam gear can not accomplish what VANOS can.
 
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Old 11-08-2018, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by llabmik2 View Post
It's not the same. A cam gear can not accomplish what VANOS can.
I never said it was or could.

I will be working on the next "head" post tomorrow. Perhaps in the interim, Jan can come up with some videos of one his heads going through CNC machining.

We can agree or disagree on what head should be used. but what I know for sure is that all of us that go the path of putting a performance head on a Gen1 MINI are never going to get our money back in a sale.
 
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Old 11-08-2018, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by cornjuice View Post
joke thread - read, no need

Nothing to see/hear except **** and vinegar. Was looking forward to seeing head work.. not just get your head 'worked' by troll posts. :( i digress.
I'll add some info that is real at least
here is the flow data for a V6 Twin Turbo caddy I am working on for another company. Making a 4L 1200hp engine for them
this is the stage 1 version on stock valves. The head is very unique, one port for turbo mount, not 3 separate exits like most

Caddy V6 twin turbo head flow STOCK

Caddy V6 twin turbo ported stage 1 stock valves
It's the first part of the testing, now off to digitize, CNC the ports and testing with stock cams
then with custom cams I am making. This is the type of testing you actually do before selling to the consumer. It's a costly and long and drawn out process

4L stroker sleeved block for V6 Caddy

 
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  #59  
Old 11-09-2018, 06:35 PM
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With the videos of porting I posted above along with my previous posts on some basics on heads, cams and valves, those that are following this thread that may not have had any idea of what was involved are now hopefully gaining a better understanding. It is not all rocket science as common sense plays more into the mixture than most people realize.

As stated previously noted there are four basic head '"modders" on this side of the Pond; Revolution Motor Works (RMW), Way Motor Works, ThumperHeads and Sneed4Speed aka S4S. Whereas RMW offers one head for the Gen1 MINI, Sneed4Speed and ThumperHeads have three different types. I am assuming that Way Motor Works can prepare a head based upon what a person wants so one would think there are more than one option available.

A brief synopsis is as follows:

Revolution Motor Works aka RMW - The RMW head is machined from a donor head so most likely the head is "used." NOTE: This is typical for all the heads being discussed here. The RMW head uses a computer controlled cutting system known as CNC that according to RMW produces tolerances in the 0.0001 range. From the RMW Site: "Our Championship winning cylinder head is at the front of the pack. Comes standard with Black nitrided 1.8mm oversized intake valves, 2.3mm oversized Inconel exhaust valves. Each head is CNC'd so each and every cylinder head is exactly the same for flow. Something that can't be done by hand! Supertech makes our valvetrain with titanium retainers and dual valve springs. The lightest in the industry for high RPM engines. All our race cams have been tested on these springs so you can rest assured there are no issues with valve float or coil bind. Our cylinder heads are used in the Grand Am winning Race Mini's along with our Race cams and Race headers. All intake seats will be replaced with bigger seats to better handle the big valves and are finished on the industry leading Serdi Machine. Each head is vacuum checked before heading out the door." The price of this head is $2,750 that includes a $400 Core Charge.

This core is a used head that most be in "good"condition. Although not specifically noted, most companies consider a head that has cracks in or around the spark plug hole defective and will not be considered a "core." RMW does not state whether the work is performed in their own shop or whether outside sources do the work. I believe the RMW head can be used to the 8,000 RPM.


Sneed4Speed aka S4S - The S4S heads, they offer three, are machined from a donor head so most likely the head is "used." NOTE: This is typical for all the heads being discussed here. The three types of heads offered are:

1.) Sport with HP Cam (from the S4S site) heads are fully rebuilt to better than OEM specs with OEM parts. Heads are decked and trued to .0001 of an inch on the engine sealing surface, then receive a high flow valve job and valve facing as well as setting the valve spring seat pressures for best performance. This is a great stock replacement head, built by the leading MINI race parts manufacturer. The Sport also has a Sneed high performance cam and new high performance valve springs. If you're tracking your MINI on a budget, this is the head for you. Direct, bolt on replacement for the stock head with a 15-20 horse power increase over the stock unit with ECU tuning, REV limiter can be increased to 8000rpm. No ECU tuning required. The price of this head is $2,456.11 that includes a $500 core charge.

2,) Race with HP Cam (from the S4S site) - heads receive everything noted for the "Sport" head, plus a full CNC porting and polishing, a Sneed high performance cam, oversized super alloy valves, and race valve springs with titanium retainers that are 45% lighter than OEM retainers. All this creates a head that makes big power, handles high boost levels and revs past 10,000 RPM without valve float. ECU tuning is required. The price of this head is $3,751.31 that includes a $500 core charge.

3.) CNC Bare Race Head (from the S4S site) - CNC ported and polished bare head. Completely ported and polished and ready for assembly machine work. Exact same head as our race head just in bare form. Head includes, port head casting, rocker arms, rails and cam caps. DOES NOT include valves, guides, springs, or cam. The price of this head is $1,449.99 that includes a $500 core charge.

S4S states that their heads are "built by the leading MINI race parts manufacturer." Core charges are involved and they have a good write up on what is acceptable as a core including that an inspection process taking up to 14 days is involved.


ThumperHeads - The ThumperHeads, they offer three, are machined from a donor head so most likely the head is "used." NOTE: This is typical for all the heads being discussed here. The three types of heads offered are:

1.) TPR1 (from the ThumperHeads site) - Is a ported Head with stock valves sized to maintain the low end when you are off the boost, the trip to work, or on the way to Jack's for fish and chips! Usual mods are the exhaust/ pulley/ CAI. This head is perfect for the spirited drive, or the occasional Track day!! MPG actually increases!!! Includes; ported intake/exhaust (roof reshaped), performance valve job, new valve seats, custom Bronzamium guides, and custom steel valve locks. Suggested RPM Redline of 7,200. The price of this head is $1795 that includes a $500 core charge.

2,) TPR2 (from the ThumperHeads site) - Suggested Mods 15-19% pulley, Cold Air Intake, exhaust, camshaft and a tune. Still not a full on Racer, however you like to show the tail lights to others. Great power mid to top end. Higher flowing larger stainless valves with the under cut stems for even more airflow. The exhaust valves are INCONEL to take more heat. Titanium retainers and valve springs for increased RPMs. Includes: +.5mm nitrate coated intake valves, +1.5mm Inconel exhaust valves, ported intake/exhaust, roof reshaped, throat & bowl pocket ported, runner cross section opened/corrected, performance valve job with flow cut, custom steel valve locks, titanium retainers, custom Bronznaium guides. custom steel locks. Suggested RPM redline of 7.500. The price of this head is $2,195 that includes a $500 core charge.

3.) TRP2-R (from the ThumperHead site) - Not just another BVH, this is custom built to your needs, your rev limitations, and cam lift!! No cookie cutter here!! This TPR-2R Head will take all the boost you can stuff in to this little engine!! Deeper port work with aggressive throat/bowl contour and smoothing. Custom Bronzanium 90 guides. PAC racing valve spring components for high revs and camshafts with over .500 lift, Larger stainless +1.8 mm intake valves. Larger +2.3 mm INCONEL exhaust valves with under cut stems. tied together with the performance valve job with the back cut (more low lift flow). Custom Steel Locks. These heads just flat ROCK!! Not suggest for the daily drive.. But some do it anyway!! Suggested RPM redline of 8,000. The price of this head is $2,495 that includes a $500 core charge.

Thumperheads does not have a description on what the "core" involves. ThumperHeads is similar to RMW whereas a "good" core must be provided but unlike Sneed4Speed he does not provides details on what "good" constitutes.
__________________________________________________


I have chosen the TPR2 from ThumperHeads. Mike Schultz, the owner, has been kind enough to provide some good details on what he does. This will be in my next post.

I would think that Waylon from Way Motor Works is aware of this thread and I would welcome any comments or details he has on the the head he offers.
 

Last edited by ThumpR52; 11-09-2018 at 06:56 PM.
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  #60  
Old 11-09-2018, 08:38 PM
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ThumperR52 - I have no idea what your background is in tuning car. I have read every word in this thread. I have ZERO experience in tuning a car other than adjusting a carburetor (turning a screw). Okay so I was able to tune my lawn mover to the point of destruction - not sure what I did to the carburetor but made a small hole bigger and the result was MORE POWER a lot more noise and it used a lot more gas. It was then able to cut (chip violently) the curb on the boulevard strip between the street and the sidewalk - and release the horse ring from it's concrete jail. It then died in a spectacular fashion. But, hey, if you have a horse and come to my house, there is a horse tie that is free.

But I do live in Portland, Oregon.

We have three MINI specific tuners in town, Craven (sort of tuner they sell a lot of tuner parts so they are included), Madness and Alta, so two and a half tuners. Now, thees guys mostly sell parts and such. I have personally spoken to all of them. I have also talked to Jan on the phone. I follow Way's and RMW's Facebook feeds. I do not enjoy Way's WTF Wednesday where he publicly invites others to join in and shame people who are not as mechanically inclined as someone who seems to be a master auto mechanic. What I can say with confidence is that tuners, no matter who they may be, are somewhat... full of themselves. Sorry guys and gals, you are all kind of A-holes. What Craven, Alta, Madness, WMW, RMW and all the rest NEED to keep in mind is that the people that come to you with questions, parts or advise is that the person you are taking to probably is a shade tree mechanic, not an ASE or what have you Master Mechanic. Some can turn a wrench just enough to change a tire, others can rebuild an engine and have it run again. Those that can turn a motor from a daily driver to a race motor will just place orders and be done with you. ThumperR52 seems to know how motors work and how they can work better. It also seems that he/she is still learning who to do all this better. This is where communication skills come in, something that 75% of all people (including mechanics and me) on Earth could use a little more knowledge. My first thought is, ThumperR52, if you didn't like RMW's responses, WMW responses will not be any more to your liking.
 
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Old 11-09-2018, 09:11 PM
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Little bit of everything here. Posts by Trolls, Trolls getting trolled and then if you don't care for either, you pick up a little bit on how an engine works. The last is what I intended but this a car forum . . . . . . .

Relative to Way, you can keep him in check if you have a real picture of him as he hates to have his picture on the web.
 
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Old 11-10-2018, 05:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Thought of a good one View Post
ThumperR52 - I have no idea what your background is in tuning car. I have read every word in this thread. I have ZERO experience in tuning a car other than adjusting a carburetor (turning a screw). Okay so I was able to tune my lawn mover to the point of destruction - not sure what I did to the carburetor but made a small hole bigger and the result was MORE POWER a lot more noise and it used a lot more gas. It was then able to cut (chip violently) the curb on the boulevard strip between the street and the sidewalk - and release the horse ring from it's concrete jail. It then died in a spectacular fashion. But, hey, if you have a horse and come to my house, there is a horse tie that is free.
Back in the day a good "Tuner" made a motor sing by fiddling with the carburetor. Their ear was their gauge and the dyno was either the seat of the pants or a stopwatch. It was an art.

Now we still use the term "Tune" but instead of taking a screwdriver to a jet, the fingers work the keyboard. The question is when there is a chip of silicone supported by electrical sensors all working thousands of times faster than the human mind, what is the Tuner doing? It is one thing to prepare a race car to operate on the "edge" and quite another to make a tweak that the wannabe feels in the seat of their pants. Then is the tweak accomplished by the tune or rather by the different part installed that the silicone chip may be able to figure out all by itself?

Just some thoughts.
 
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Old 11-10-2018, 09:56 AM
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I am glad that I stay out of this thread so far. I will just give my 2 shillings. Any vendor who interject and attack a home mechanic or owner choosing their path of modification and trying to learn and experience themselves is bad form. Worst is to attack the competitions who never partake in the thread. Sure, we all know this is your chosen profession, and may be you are better than your competitions. Do you have to attack them?

If you think you are god, try look around you in the performance industry. Go read Hot Rod magazine. All these tricks of extracting another few HP/FP has been done since you were wearing diaper. Very little has changed except what the advance of computer make these arts so much easier if you can afford the capital expenditure or make the industry's connection. ICE days are numbered. Right now hybrid is king, but soon may be the turn for all electric when energy density of batteries and charge time takes a quantum leap.
 

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Old 11-11-2018, 08:48 AM
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I asked Mike Schutlz, ThumperHeads, some questions over the past several weeks that are pertinent to this thread. So:


I have a 06 JCW that already has a RMW Dominator Cam, 450 injectors and one of Jan's tunes. Since that time I have changed my pulley ratio to 19%, added an OBX 4-2-1 header, and a 200 cell cat converter. I do have a water/meth injection system that I use if I am doing some mountain runs as I live in North Carolina. I do not plan on tuning for meth, rather just use a 40% meth/60% water mix for cooling the intake manifold temps.

In your opinion, which of your heads should I use but also assume you can machine one to fit my needs. I do not autocross nor track the car. Car has just over 60,000 miles on it. I also just changed the bearings out in the transmission and put in a new clutch. I see you have some honed/polished intakes as well. What is your thought on them as I have more boost with the 19% pulley?

Ok to help you. The intermediate Head will suit your purpose. TPR2 . The + 1.5 exhaust valve is an Inconel Stainless steel, and the +.5 stainless intake will take the add'l 19% pulley. The slightly smaller valves (than the TPR2r ) will help in keeping that good torque that you have on the streets or those mountain roads. Adding in the TPR2r will allow more top end but with the camshaft you have there is no need. I can assume Jan put your revs at 7500 , or 7000 rpm??

Yes the matched intake is good idea. that intake is the last restriction for the head.. When you decide to do this remind me you have the OBX and I can match the exhaust, cool??


I assume you have a MINI, what do you have?

I had an 02 and now an 06. Both were R53s.


What is your background with engines?

My experience is in building heads for blower and turbo American V8s. I bought a brand new Fastback Mustang in 1967 that I still have. You can see a video of it on my Facebook Page. Later on bought a MINI in 2002 and first I went with a 15% pulley, then I reworked the head. I continued to work the head by adding bigger valves. At one time with a shot of NOS, I had 348 WHP.

In the beginning I had a partner with a full shop and a Superflow 600 Bench. For the MINI, i started by opening up the port cross section a bit. A velocity probe was used to make sure I didn't kill velocity here and increase volume there. I found that a short radius was good. Bowl and throats were opened up between the valve and the seat. I used the 600 to verify and record all the information. Then I went through the head and measured everything myself, ha as I am an old school guy that likes a pad and a pencil. The partner and I split as his wife said no more shop. So now there is just me and no bench but I still have that pad with all the measurements. Between that data, snap guides, mics, velocity probes and 50 years of gearhead common sense I turn out some good stuff.


From your website and Facebook I see you work on intake manifolds and heads. What else do you sell?

I am a not a Tuner, I am an old engine builder and cylinder head man. I work on heads and intakes also selling adjustable cam gears, gaskets and head studs that go with my work. I have developed my own MINI cams. We went thru the entire US looking for a cam grinder that would supply a good core and cut to our specifications. The US folks said the market is too small for them. So then I went overseas with Newman Cams in the UK that also makes the cams for RMW. Newman is cutting our cams integrated with their cams. I now feel good by having two cams for the r50s ( track and street ) 2 cams for the street track r53 and two racing cams - short track and long track.


What is done with the intake manifolds?

The intake has the plenum and the runner. You see front side of the plenum under the intercooler. The runners you can’t see and connect to the head. We will open the runners up to the size of the ported Intake runner on the cylinder head. This allows a smooth transition from the intake manifold into the cylinder head. The end result is a wider venturi effect from the plenum thru the runner to the head.


What is the “choke point” that you read about?

There is a Choke point in the cylinder head, about 1.5-1.6" into the runner (that the head has going from where the intake manifold is connected to the valve). This is again to assist the velocity from the opened port. Take out too much and the air flow will slow ( yes even boosted) and tumble. The idea is to keep everything sized for the best velocity.


What is your main goal with the heads you offer?

My goal is not to make a race team, it is to make a fast street car !! The head is only one part as injector sizes, cam, boost levels, exhausts and tunes are all important. For me it is not about the size of the ports but rather the velocity.


Can you tell me a little about your process?

Finding that many of the heads sent back as cores here in the US are cracked. The Euro heads are a little better that could be due to different oils and fuels.

I clean the head and inspect for cracks ( sublet Shop for pressure test) Remove the valves and the springs and retainers. Remove the cast steel Valve guides, install a hi performance bronze guides, then fit each one to the valve. If no cracks found, we inspect the seats. Start on the port work. Using a snap gauge and mic's we remove certain amounts ( depending on application ) from the choke area and the roof of the runners, then into the throats and the bowls. Lots of measuring for correct specs.

Valve job is a 5 angle performance street Job. This means the seats are a little fatter than an all out racing valve job as the work has to last a lot longer. 3 angles on the seat.. two on the valve. We then hand lap the valves in, do a vacuum check on the valve seal and rock !! We use high performance blue Nitrile valve seals on all heads.

Valve train on TPR1 is a balanced spring set with stock retainers ( 7200 rpm limit). TPR2 is the same but we use the lighter Titanium retainers ( 7500 rpm limit). TPR2r Is a whole new valve train.. PAC racing springs and titanium retainers ( 8000+ rpm limit ).
 

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  #65  
Old 11-12-2018, 06:00 AM
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In talking shop, Mike does not say "flow," he says "velocity." From my years in construction I am aware of both CFM, cubic feet per minute, and FPM, feet per minute, relative to a HVAC system. The FPM is the velocity of the air and the higher the velocity the greater amount of CFM you will have.

Its like torgue and horsepower as you determine the torque, do some calculations and then come up with the horsepower. In other words, car engines and most MINI owners like velocity . . . . . . . .
 
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Old 11-12-2018, 08:45 AM
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That is an interesting comment from Mike about many of the heads he gets as cores are cracked. That isn’t one that shows up on NAM as a point of failure for these engines, from what I have seen. Also, curious that the Euro heads seem to be better and that he thinks maybe that it might be gas or oil. Seems odd that gas or oil would result in cracked heads vs over heating and/or over torquing head bolts.
 
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Old 11-12-2018, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Eddie07S View Post
That is an interesting comment from Mike about many of the heads he gets as cores are cracked. That isn’t one that shows up on NAM as a point of failure for these engines, from what I have seen. Also, curious that the Euro heads seem to be better and that he thinks maybe that it might be gas or oil. Seems odd that gas or oil would result in cracked heads vs over heating and/or over torquing head bolts.
Yes, general consensus is that the difference is the quality of European fuel vs ours.
Unless the engine has overheated, most cracks in Mini Heads are heat stress cracks around the valve seats, and much of that is from improperly burned fuel.
You'd be shocked at the number of Mini owners who use mid-grade or regular just to save a buck or two per tank, with the "seems to run just fine" argument.
 
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Old 11-12-2018, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by ThumpR52 View Post

Revolution Motor Works aka RMW - The RMW head is machined from a donor head so most likely the head is "used." NOTE: This is typical for all the heads being discussed here. The RMW head uses a computer controlled cutting system known as CNC that according to RMW produces tolerances in the 0.0001 range. From the RMW Site: "Our Championship winning cylinder head is at the front of the pack. Comes standard with Black nitrided 1.8mm oversized intake valves, 2.3mm oversized Inconel exhaust valves. Each head is CNC'd so each and every cylinder head is exactly the same for flow. Something that can't be done by hand! Supertech makes our valvetrain with titanium retainers and dual valve springs. The lightest in the industry for high RPM engines. All our race cams have been tested on these springs so you can rest assured there are no issues with valve float or coil bind. Our cylinder heads are used in the Grand Am winning Race Mini's along with our Race cams and Race headers. All intake seats will be replaced with bigger seats to better handle the big valves and are finished on the industry leading Serdi Machine. Each head is vacuum checked before heading out the door." The price of this head is $2,750 that includes a $400 Core Charge.

This core is a used head that most be in "good"condition. Although not specifically noted, most companies consider a head that has cracks in or around the spark plug hole defective and will not be considered a "core." RMW does not state whether the work is performed in their own shop or whether outside sources do the work. I believe the RMW head can be used to the 8,000 RPM.

.
Let me break down the heads that I offer as the post doesn't accurately tell the story
Stage 1 head, 1.8mm intake/2.3mm inconel exhaust valves $2350 (multiple national championships)
Stage 2 head 1.8mm intake/27mm inconel exhaust valves $2550 (multiple national championships)
Stage 3 head 33mm intake valves/28mm inconel exhaust valves No price yet (prototype with flow numbers coming)

for all of those interested in performance ask your porter for flow numbers of your head. You might be surprised in what you find
 
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Old 11-12-2018, 12:00 PM
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Having had the blessings to be around some of the best guys in the world at porting heads and picking their brains over the years.( these are guys with world records) Some of the stuff done by them go 100% against what was said in this thread, it all depends on the applications. Many of the stuff you are quoting is for normally aspirated applications where velocity is the main ingredient. In boosted applications its how big of doorway do you have to get it through. Velocity won't save you when the doorway is too small to allow it through.

Waiting for the Chrysler engineer to come in and clean up the mess on aisle 4

I have a challenge to dispel all of the theory vs reality types.....who wants to play along?

I'll build a normally aspirated engine to compete against anyone here. I guarantee you I will have bigger valves than you, bigger ports than you and we can see who comes out on top of the hp/tq equation
bring your biggest baddest engine you can build with the W10/11 engine and we will see whose theories actually translate into real world power
I think it's a great way to end the myth's that keep getting thrown around in the Mini Community. It's a disservice to all

Nothing like getting the competitive juices flowing for all of the vendors to keep making better products for the community

We can set a date for late next year so everyone has plenty of time to get their best attempts done

We can get one of the magazines involved and probably find a neutral place where we can engine dyno the entires. Maybe a go-fund me for the vendors to recover their costs to ship engines/travel to the site.........who is in?
 
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Old 11-12-2018, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by BlwnAway View Post
Yes, general consensus is that the difference is the quality of European fuel vs ours.
Unless the engine has overheated, most cracks in Mini Heads are heat stress cracks around the valve seats, and much of that is from improperly burned fuel.
You'd be shocked at the number of Mini owners who use mid-grade or regular just to save a buck or two per tank, with the "seems to run just fine" argument.
I have the choice of 2 grades of gas: an ethanol blend (<= 10%) at 93 octane and non-ethanol at 91 octane. Both my stock S (N18) and base Copper (R50) run noticeably better on the non-ethanol and on the track the S reaches the same top end with either gas meaning it is making the same HP with both gases. Given this, am I doing my engines a disservice running the 91 in them or is that a high enough octane? I assume in Europe they don’t have a blend gas like we do, but I don’t know the octane they have.
 
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Old 11-12-2018, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Revolution Motor Works View Post
Having had the blessings to be around some of the best guys in the world at porting heads and picking their brains over the years.( these are guys with world records) Some of the stuff done by them go 100% against what was said in this thread, it all depends on the applications. Many of the stuff you are quoting is for normally aspirated applications where velocity is the main ingredient. In boosted applications its how big of doorway do you have to get it through. Velocity won't save you when the doorway is too small to allow it through.

Waiting for the Chrysler engineer to come in and clean up the mess on aisle 4

I have a challenge to dispel all of the theory vs reality types.....who wants to play along?

I'll build a normally aspirated engine to compete against anyone here. I guarantee you I will have bigger valves than you, bigger ports than you and we can see who comes out on top of the hp/tq equation
bring your biggest baddest engine you can build with the W10/11 engine and we will see whose theories actually translate into real world power
I think it's a great way to end the myth's that keep getting thrown around in the Mini Community. It's a disservice to all

Nothing like getting the competitive juices flowing for all of the vendors to keep making better products for the community

We can set a date for late next year so everyone has plenty of time to get their best attempts done

We can get one of the magazines involved and probably find a neutral place where we can engine dyno the entires. Maybe a go-fund me for the vendors to recover their costs to ship engines/travel to the site.........who is in?
In engineering, the basic formula for calculating CFM is FPM x Area. I also know that there is both velocity pressure and static pressure. When the wind flips your hat off, that is velocity pressure. Static pressure, that is normally measured in inches of water, is the amount of resistance within the pathway. The higher the static pressure the more force is required to push the air through the pathway. Hopefully a Mechanical PE will step in as I am having a difficult time wrapping my arms around that boosted comment above.

The engine build is a good idea but that should be discussed elsewhere and not here.
 
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Old 11-12-2018, 08:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Eddie07S View Post


I have the choice of 2 grades of gas: an ethanol blend (<= 10%) at 93 octane and non-ethanol at 91 octane. Both my stock S (N18) and base Copper (R50) run noticeably better on the non-ethanol and on the track the S reaches the same top end with either gas meaning it is making the same HP with both gases. Given this, am I doing my engines a disservice running the 91 in them or is that a high enough octane? I assume in Europe they don’t have a blend gas like we do, but I don’t know the octane they have.
The 91 is fine, in many parts of the US 91 is as good as it gets, and that's blended, to have an unblended 91 is a nice option.
Most US regular is 87 and mid is 89.

The real test would be to see if there's a difference in EGT's between the two.
​​​​​
 
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Old Yesterday, 06:18 AM
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Another portion of the head cracking equation could be the driving styles. We Colonials love our cars while the Brits and their Euro counterparts do allot of long distance via train. Where 100 miles is nothing for us, it is a big deal for those on the other side of the pond. Could be that as our engines see more "prolonged runs" we have more issues.

Back to Mike and his ThumperHeads, he comes off as a person that takes pride in what he does in an unassuming manner.
 

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Old Yesterday, 11:09 AM
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10 Myths about Cylinder Head Porting

Hmmmm, some very interesting comments in the below article. Discusses many issues that have been brought up here all made by the owner of a machine shop specializing in engine heads albeit not BMW/MINI.

http://speed.academy/10-myths-of-cyl...KxTEjuybc_BNeA
 

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Old Yesterday, 11:13 AM
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maybe you should just quit trying to evade the real test
head to head concepts on the same car..........what could you possibly be scared of?
 
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