What would you choose and why?

RMW Street Cam is probably the same price installed as a catback exhaust. So - which one do you choose?

Thanks guys.

 

Do you want to go faster or do you want to sound like it goes faster? The cam also opens up the need for further changes. You'll very strongly want to consider a tune and other related upgrades. I don't know personally if you can just throw in that cam and call it a day but Helix seems to suggest otherwise.

 

Hey Gitmoe - I'm actually thinking of heading down to helix when Jan is here for a tuning day in May and have them install the cam and then take it from install bay to dyno and tune.

I want to go gain responsiveness and speed. I don't really care much on the exhaust sound or not.

 

Sounds like you have an answer. I live real close to Helix. They just fixed my broken R53 budget track project. It's going back again probably next week to have a few more things sorted out. They're amazing. Well worth the ride down.

 

I worked from the ground up, personally. First mod was an exhaust and them worked on suspension. Then, I focused on engine mods. I wanted to make sure the car was in tip top shape before modding for engine performance.

 

This seems like sound logic. I usually like to throw logic out the window, especially when modding cars but its great advice to give others...

 

Thanks Pelican - I just don't think that an exhaust has a better bang for the buck than a cam. I am also trying to determine which things should be done before the tune -- my guess is that an exhaust is not going to benefit much from better tuning -- whereas a cam would require it. I also don't really believe the exhaust will yield that much in gains at all (besides the cool factor).

Suspension is mostly stock and will stay that way -- I scrape as it is going in and out of my driveway right now. Car is currently driven less than 200 miles a month. All major maintenance has been done, 22mm sway bar, DDM intake, 15% pulley. SO....this is all for fun really.

Oh and --- major mods are off the table -- I can't justify that given the limited use of this car.

 

It depends on what other mod's you already have (like a pulley) and what you plan next after this step. A cam alone with a stock pulley, head, header & cat-back and no re-tune is probably only going to give you a few HP on the top end, and you'll probably lose some low end torque and definitely will lose some idle quality.


A good cat-back will probably gain you 4-5 HP with no other changes and no re-tune.


A better option might be a good header, with no pre-cat. That alone with no re-tune should give you 5 HP with a slight bump up in mid range torque and no loss in idle quality.


If you have a well ported head, then a good cat-back, cam and header can really take advantage of a 15-17% pulley. Could probably pull 230 BHP just with those mods.

 

its hard to say what a cam will get you without the supporting mods. a cam is designed to allow more flow through the engine. a pulley is an easy way to get an extra ~50% air into the car, 10 psi to 15 psi. then the intake box starts to become a bit of a hinderance with the filter, CAI helps that out. with air in, air needs out, so the exhaust helps.


but a cam and adjustable cam gear can change the torque band. extra lift and duration help, but you may not see the same gains as people with the extra mods. and it is true, not all cams need tunes, the aggressive cams do, but mild cams (slight more lift, slight more duration) will work with stock tune, but a tune will further improve upon.


you are in a place that not many people dare to go. most modders will have all the basic bolt ons before getting into the guts of an engine. mild cams with all the supporting mods get a gain of about 4-5 hp without a tune, and about 10-15 with the tune. so without all the supporting mods I think you would be looking at less. but have the chance of changing the torque curve. if you do a dyno without the supporting mods, I would definently be interested on how that works out!

 

Hey Unbreakable / Salty Salt -- thanks for the insightful responses... I am torn. I want to get the main mods that I think are realistic for the car (not really going to invest in a head realistically) before I do the tune. Is the cam worth it -- I'm not truly convinced... could be only 5hp...an exhaust will give me more "fun sounds" and probably would yield the same or a bit more HP. My exhaust is starting to show wear with some initial surface rust coming on the mufflers themselves so will likely require replacement at some point... is this that point?

I'll have to make a decision before May -- I am trying to get down the Helix tuning day and want to make some sort of decision before then.

 

Wondering if it should be a header than...although does that necessitate a good catback.

 

Id start with the basics first before getting a cam, the cam really needs the basics to work best.

 

I think that you answered your own question earlier. If it's looking like your cat-back exhaust will need replacing soon, then replace it! It's probably the best all-round decision for you.

 

I fabricated a custom exhaust that added a decent bit of torque and power out of straight 2.5" piping and a large magnaflow resonator (glorified glass pack resonator). Although I routed it directly under the battery box, it's worked very well the last few years. Downside is how loud it is, even on the factory exhaust manifold. Working over or replacing the factory manifold is my next big exhaust project.

I would go for the best flowing exhaust first and a header second before looking at a cam. The cam will only allow the head to flow as freely as the exhaust will allow it to, and the less restriction on a forced induction engine the better.

 

i just lost all my low end torque after installing my header......very frustrated!!!! probably re-installing the factory header this weekend if i can't tune back in some low end.....it makes an r50.

 

Yeah - r50 really needs some level of back pressure...sorry. Sucks you had to do all the work to install it.

 

what header did you have? catted or catless?

 

Let me say...it depends on your driving style....sure they are complementary when done in tandem...
but a few thoughts....
A cam can make a car VERY fun to drive IF YOU KEEP THE MOTOR IN THE RIGHT RPM RANGE for the cam used.....
Put the wrong cam in...and the driving dynamics can make driving it on the street terrible...a full "race" cam with GREAT REDLINE power can make low rpm in town driving hard...especially if you have a lightened flywheel....YES, EVERY PART must be considered....
ME...I would do the Exhaust....the one you have is likely corroded, and near failure....and you will hear it and smile EVERYDAY...
A CAM will make you smile at REDLINE...but maybe a couple times a day at most unless you drive like an AZZ....
IF you are building a weekend driver...I might do the exhaust, save a few $$, then do the CAM and tune later,....

 

It's not so much that it needs backpressure, but that performance headers tend to have primary runner diameters that are too large for the R50 and then don't pressure wave tune properly for it. For the R50, a primary runner ID of 1-3/8" is perfect, but pretty much all Gen1 Mini performance headers are made for the R53 and are 1.5" ID or even larger (I've seen some advertised as 1.6" ID).


When the primary diameters get too large, there's a big drop off of exhaust gas velocity and a reversion pressure wave gets created, which then anti-tunes at a lower RPM. An R50 will perform great with 1-3/8" ID runners and low backpressure CAT's and Cat-back exhaust.

 

yeah you would need head work, a cam and keep them revs up! for a nice large runner

 

I would get the rmw cam. $360 plus $15 shipping. the only thing you need to install it is a new cam bolt. maybe a new tensioner if yours might be getting weak. I installed my rmw cam myself with no special tools. I don't think it was that hard. 2- 3 hrs max. if you are going to a tuning party, they could tune for the cam. I think the cam and tune, 15% pulley and CAI can get you into the 200 club.

 

Cam should be the last thing before tune. Exhaust and intake would be my first choice. Apart from replacing all the worn bushings and mounts.

The came theoretically is between the intake and exhaust l, and changes the amount of time the engine spends suckling in, and pushing out air. If the factory intake is restricting how much can be sucked in at a given time, and the factory exhaust is restricting how much can be pushed out at a given time, then the cam won't perform as well, even with a tune, as it would with the nice intake and exhaust with it.

Intake and/or exhaust first, (id suggest both) THEN cam, then tune will net you best results, otherwise you will have to pay for tune again if you get cam then tune before exhaust, then have to tune again to get best results from cam and exhaust.

 

well he already said he has a DDM cold air intake. he was thinking about going to a tuning party, so why not get the cam? for $360 I think it's the cheapest next gain in HP. a good catback exhaust is gonna cost $850 (milltek or stratmophere) for what 5hp? Yes it will sound awesome and no drone, but a cam might get him 10-12 hp. I'm still running a stock catback and putting out 216 whp. at this power level, the exhaust is not really limiting his power. The original poster said he didn't care about the exhaust sound.

 

Exhaust first, then Cam.
You really need to open the exhaust up more to let the Cam work properly.
Plus, under normal circumstances:
Exhaust... Won't really matter as much if you tune.
Cam... You'll want to tune, then add exhaust... you really should tune again to get the most of the Cam, to work with the free'r flow.

 

cat delete.