Yeah... I'm going for the re-tune before anything else. It could very well be an issue with the current tuning maps.

While I know some folks have posted MAP issues and fixes, I was talking with Dan Zipkin at Grassroots Garage yesterday - he said that in the 6+ years he's been doing this, and the hundreds of MINIs he's diagnosed and repaired, he has seen ONE bad MAP sensor. One.

No doubt they go bad sometimes. But he believes a lot of folks are replacing them when that's not the problem...

 

Yeah, I was sitting here thinking of all the possibilities (which is a dangerous thing), and the only thing I could think of is maybe the tuning. The MAP sensor was a good call, but judging by your description, I doubt this is the problem. Stick with the retune for now. The parts seem to be playing nice together, but lack an efficient "leader" to band them together.

 

Yeah, the car has been throwing some "rich condition" codes at idle. I've changed my ScanGauge to display short term fuel trim and am going to pay more attention to what it's doing at that area of the RPM range...

 

Paul,
This is outa left field and way of thread but It's nagging me.Have you found anyone who has changed their tranny fluid in our cars(auto)??Danny said it couldnt be done.I wanna, but know not where to turn.

thanks

 

I don't know anyone personally who has done this... but I plan to in another 10-20K - Dan Zipkin at Grassroots Garage knows how to do it... and the stuff to use...

Edit:
As I recall - there is a plug on the top of the tranny pan for checking the fluid level. You can use a big syringe and tube to suck out fluid and replace with new fluid. That won't get all the old fluid out, so you have to do a couple of exchanges for good measure. You can get the same Aisin fluid via Toyota (I think) much cheaper (but still not cheap).

 

...cool.I heard rumor of the suction method.
thanks

 

So how is Blimey these days? What is the latest in this continuing saga?

 

He's a little healthier - but still a little quirky. Occasionally throwing rich codes, but not as often. Still has the "flat spot" below 4000RPM with power really coming in around 4000-4200 as before. I'm waiting on a re-tune to see if that does it... So I just keep it above 4200RPM and all is perfect.

 

That sounds alot like the issue I am having after installing the DT BPV. I get a flat spot with no boost at light throttle then if I give it more gas it kicks right in.

 

Paul just to make it official and to give the thread a bump:

I have a somewhat similar problem. Only difference is I had a spark plug blow out on me. No limp mode but horrendous lack of power! I had an insert put in and put 4 new Brisk plugs and new wires while at it. Ever since then the car is a dog from idle all the way up to 4000 rpms, then it clears up and pulls like it did before i lost the spark plug. I too thought it was a BPV and blew $120 on a Detroit Tuned valve only to find out the same thing is still happening. Any throttle input past 50% at any rpm range from idle to 4000 and the car falls flat on its face. I think it has something to do with my insert and I'm in the process of swapping out the head with a used one. I just can't tell if its a spark problem or fuel problem. I didn't think its a spark problem because the wires are on tight at the coil and down on top of the plugs, the plugs are all torqued to factory specs and new wires. This is definitely something related to the spark plug blowing out cuz it wasn't doing this prior to the plug incident. I'm just baffled though

Steve

EDIT: Just FYI the check engine light comes on if I rev it to redline in any of the higher gears. So I brought it to my dealer and they scanned for the codes and it was a DME code108 "Absolute pressure in intake manifold - barometric pressure - input high" They tested the intake pressure sensor (MAP sensor) and the diagnostic computer could not find any faults with it (whatever that means) I'm wondering if there is a way you can test the sensor like say a resistance value? Anyone with a Bentley manual have any information on diagnosing a MAP sensor? I still think it has something to do with the spark plug insert but perhaps the MAP sensor failed when it lost all compression in the 1 cylinder???

 

I guess now after reading your posts Paul that its not related to the spark plug blowing out, but my symptoms do seem to be a little worse. It actually got a little worse after I put the DT BPV in. It hesitates very badly at anything past 50% throttle input in every gear from idle all the way up to 3500-4000 and then clears up. You not only can feel the hesitation as it jerks you back and forth but you can hear the hesitation in the whine of the supercharger too. I sometimes have to downshift 3 gears just to accelerate up a slight hill cuz the car just has no power down in the lower rpm band

 

Vernon, not sure if you've read my thread, but I'm having similar problems. I had the barometric pressure fault. When I took it up into high RPMs, it would kick into limp mode. Last night, for laughs, I cleared the faults and reset the computer. I then took her for a "spirited" drive. Nothing but crisp responsiveness. Today, the same thing. We shall see how long this lasts. The reason I did this was desperation. My wife drove the MINI this morning because I had to have her windshield replaced in her Mazda. I didn't want her to freak out if the car went into limp mode while she was on the highway. Keep us posted.

 

Vernon - do you have new OEM wires on there or some other brand?

I have Kingsborne wires - outer jacket is worn, but inner jacket looks fine. I'll swap my almost-new OEM wires back on and test - I don't think I've tried that yet...

 

Paul hey sorry I'm late, been busy at work!!! yeah I have the OEM wires but they are the blue ones from the accessory catalog. Its too bad there isn't an inexpensive way to measure pulse width on the injectors and ignition spark because I'd love to eliminate them as possibilities. It runs like there is a vacuum leak, like a misfire stumbling feeling but only in those specific rpm bands and only past 50% throttle input. Very strange how detailed the parameters are that need to be met to cause this condition.

Fatherdeath: So you dont know what the solution is to that code huh? Is there a diagnostic flowchart to follow in regards to that code in the Bentley manual (dont have one yet)??? I get the code and the SES light comes on but it only stays on for maybe one or two starts and shuts back off. Also no limp mode or EML light for me, just the SES light comes on. After I installed the DT BPV I reset the computer, seemed to make it even worse. Now I can't even blip the throttle to rev match downshifting. I used to just do a quick blip and I'd get the rpms to raise 1200-1500 and easily downshift. Now if I do the same motion it raises maybe 500 and cuts out so I can't even heel toe anymore!!

On a side note, its too bad my car wasn't running properly cuz that DT BPV is sick. Even with super light pressure they car wants to accelerate and if I"m at WOT and come off the gas in gear the lunge is incredible, just such an increase in boost overall! Gotta get this car running right again and get a dyno tune and I'll be sooooo happy with my car.

 

Got my AutoEnginuity package today and got it installed - the latest stuff uses new hardware that supposedly increases the data acquisition and logging rates 4x on BMWs... seems pretty reasonable when I tested it in the garage this afternoon. I'm gonna log some data on various things (RPM, throttle position, pedal position, injector cycle/fueling, ignition timing, load, etc.) and see if I can see any correlation between anything and the lag...

Mine started with the yo-yo.... and the DT BPV to fix that. I've wondered if going back to a good new OEM BPV would change anything. I've tested with the BPV diaphragm disconnected so it's always closed... still had the same symptom... so the BPV doesn't seem to be the culprit... but still...

And yeah, steve, what you're describing is exactly what I get.

 

OK, this AutoEnginuity thing is pretty sweet. Not perfect... but sweet.

Due to the update speed over the OBD-II bus on the R50/52/53, you can only get about 4 data points per second - so if you pull four items at once, you get about one refresh per second for each item. You can query more, it just slows the refresh rate for each series of data.

I did a bunch of runs and logged 3-8 points on each run, depending on what I was doing. Ended up with about 8 csv files of data, about 3 minutes for each run. Once you're back home and disconnected from the car, you can play the data back in near-real-time within AutoEnginuity and see the variables charted out just as they were captured - which makes it really easy to visually see possible correlations.

I just spent a couple of hours playing with this data in Excel and producing some charts I could post. Due to limitations in Excel (only two Y data axes) I couldn't combine all the series I would sometimes like on these - but I think I have enough combinations that you can see what's going on. I've already learned a bit about the symptoms that I didn't know going in - so this seems worthwhile so far.

OK, here goes. Once on the road, I did several cycles of full throttle / no throttle. Here's a chart of Pedal Position, vs. Throttle Position, vs. RPM over time:


One thing I already learned from this - look at how, when the pedal is floored, the throttle initially opens wide (80+ degrees) then immediately closes back to about 40 degrees, then re-opens to 80+ degrees when you hit the "magic" RPM over 4000. This is quite repeatable. The cases where this doesn't show up may just be due to the data sampling rates not catching it, because otherwise the curves are pretty consistent. So I understand WHAT is happening a bit better, but WHY?

Here's RPM vs. Boost. While I didn't show it on this chart - you can assume pedal and throttle are behaving exactly like above in relation to the RPM. Note that boost drops in the middle of each RPM climb - corresponding to the throttle opening then closing then opening again - what you'd expect, since boost is dependent on an open throttle to provide air. I don't think this tells us "why" - just more "what"...


Now for three charts that hopefully some guru will be able to help us interpret... First, what is the pre-cat O2 sensor reading?


Hmmmm. Anything between 0.45v and 0.95v is "rich", anything under 0.45v is "lean"... now, this isn't wideband, so you can't really tell magnitude of the richness or leanness - and I don't know what this "should" look like... but intuitively, it seems to me that the car is running rich at WOT? Is that what this means?


Here's what's happening to the Spark Advance:


And there is a small amount of "Knock Control" being applied at WOT also:


Soooooo.... Ok geniuses... any ideas? Any other data I could be capturing that might provide more clues? I have the raw data behind the charts and can provide if that helps...

 

I've been reading a bunch of the older MAP sensor threads... there's some really odd things that can happen as a result of MAP sensor issues..... I'm going to do some more logging of the map values specifically - possible that AutoEnginuity won't find anything due to slow sampling rates... but worth a try... May change both sensors just for the helluvit. Not a lot of money.

 

Agree, I think they are about $60 each, if you wanted to take steps I guess the one in the intake would be the place to start.

I have not read all of the related thread, but ~48K miles would not be unheard of for a MAP sensor failure.

Worth a shot!

 

I'm at 44K...started around 40K so I'm starting to lean towards the map sensor as well. Like I was saying before: Anyone have any type of diagnostic flow chart from either a bentley manual or a BMW service tool? I'd be interested to see what types of testing can be done on the sensor to determine if it is functioning properly. Anyone???

Steve

 

Please keep this thread alive until the source of the problem is conclusively identified and resolved. I have a similarly equipped car (2005 MCSa w/. RMW cam, header and tune; Alta 17% s/c pulley and 380 cc injectors). I don't have the miles that the rest of you have on your cars, but I would like to know how the issue gets to a successful conclusion in case I experience it in the future.

Blimey, what hp and ft/lbs did your car put down after being tuned?

 

Steve - I have the Bentley Diagnosis without Guesswork book. Has testing procedures for the sensors. I tested my TMAP not long ago and all was fine. I can also view live data from the sensors (via the ECU) using AutoEnginuity and can log with relatively slow sample rates and the sensors *seem* to report what they should. But I'm going to do some more logging this week.

caminifan - 183HP/163TQ - on an auto, before my cam and header. looking forward to a re-tune soon.

 

Paul and the rest of you guys. My car has started acting up again. Kicked a Manifold Atmospheric Pressure code again. Now, getting on it causes misfires. Yesterday was a random misfire code. Both MAP sensors were ordered today. I'm going to pull the plugs and have a look at them, but I'm seriously leaning towards the MAP sensor/sensors being bad, Until then, I'm babying Lily. Not sure which sensor is bad, but I'll just replace them both. Once I change the sensors, I'll let you all know what I come up with.

 

Thanks Tim - TMAP/MAP are on my shopping list - but I may hold off and see if it resolves your problem first.

 

Yeah, they should get here by Thursday. I'm going to change them out immediately. I hope this is the problem.

 

me too man, this has been going on since february and I'm really sick of it and want my power back

Steve