I was going to do the CT Valley 4/13 event until I saw that I had to spend an extra $100 (or whatever it would be) to take the car to a shop. I was hoping to get out earlier, but it looks like LRP 5/20 with SCDA will be my first day out this year.

 

Check CTV’s web page. They have members in the CT area that will do the inspection in addition to the shops they list. Not sure if the members charge or not. You could also contact them and see if there is flexibility in their rules.

Gkp - Did you get an email from SCDA with a survey about going to open passing rules?

 

No, I didn't. Were they talking about passing without a wave by? Or passing with a wave by anywhere on the track? All groups?

 

I found my email and it was a survey sent only to advanced drivers. It was about the creation of an “Expert” run group that drivers with a racing license, instructors and vetted advanced drivers would be in and they could pass anywhere (corners, straights) with a point by. I am not a fan of that idea and would never use that group. At LRP I have had enough problems with advanced group drivers who clearly have an attitude and seem to think MINIs shouldn’t be out with them and that they just get in the way to know that giving those drivers one more excuse to dive bomb me would be a bad idea. That said, SCDA would still keep the Advanced group that would use the current rules and instructors could opt for that run group instead of the Expert group. The “Instructor” run group would be eliminated. As long as SCDA keeps the Advanced group, I don’t care if they create a demolition derby group, unless it runs into my session run times. Running with instructors is a good learning experience.

 

Before long I imagine the "Expert" group would become known as the Demolition Derby Group. BTW, thanks for pointing out the list of approved inspectors on the CT Valley page. I saw that link when I was downloading the tech form but thought it was something else and didn't look at it. It turns out the shop that works on my MINI is listed. As a result, I'm now signed up for 4/13. It's the earliest I've ever gone out but I'm antsy this year it's the only date I can do before late May. Hopefully I'll get lucky with a day in the 60s.

 

I run in open anywhere passing groups and some that are wheels straight with a point

 

I have run in 2 "invitation only" groups that ran/run (one no longer runs there) at Watkins Glen. Basically there are only 2 rules for these groups - play nice and no passing in the esses. One guy shows up in a Jagermeister 962 Porsche (actually 2 in this video):

A guy I was with was running a 700 hp stock car, another a 700 hp stock truck. I've even seen a F1 race car at these events. Everyone knew what they were doing. I was the odd one out and talked with people to understand what was expected of me. This is a well vetted group of people and I trust them. Fortunately, they seemed to trust me. And no one had any issues with the MINI "not going fast enough". Can't say the same for some of the people/drivers I have come across at Lime Rock Park, sad to say.

 

Hey, it may be snowing in VT but I am putting my summer “shoes” on Smokey and we have signed up for a day at LRP on 5/17 with Patroons BMWCCA.

Any other takers?

 

I'm going to do Patroons on Friday or SCDA on Monday — not sure yet which one. I'll let you know.

 

Hmmmm
When I have been faced with a tough decision like this, I have been known to choose both....

Hey, I am told by Tire Rack that there will be a Bridgestone tire rebate starting on Thursday, if anyone needs tires...like me

 

gkp - Did you go? It should have been a great day.

 

Yes, and man-oh-man did I luck out on the weather! Was very happy with the Manic tune (and testing the tune was the only reason I risked going out in April). The tune can be run at 25%, 50% or 100%. I only ran it at 50% but the extra torque in fourth gear was impressive and especially useful. Unfortunately, I had to bail out of the fourth session. The brakes were a bit grippy all day. Not smooth. I attributed it to the Wilwood pads on the front which I have never used before. Toward the end of the third session I developed serious brake judder and on the final lap it almost felt like my right front locked up at the end of the straight. That plus a nagging headache sent me home early. But overall a successful day. I'll decide next week whether to do Patroons or SCDA at the end of May. Hey, Veggie Vet, any track day plans yet?

 

That is great about the Tune!
What stage did you get?
I am jealous!

Gkp - What Wilwood pads did you try?
Also, what pads are you running in the rear?

I had a lot of problems with the Wilwood pads (even the Poly H) at WGI. Sounds like you are having the same issue that I had - lumpy rotors. Felt like the rotors became badly warped. I finally went to the Hawk DTC60 pads in front and that got rid of the problem. I ran those pads at LRP with good success. Actually, I ran the DTC60 pads in the rear, too.

I talked to a number of people at WGI who run the Wilwood calipers and 11.75” rotors on E36 race cars and they said the Hawk DTC60 pad was their preferred pad. I also had people say that the Wilwood pads were known for leaving unwanted deposits on the rotors. My guess is, that the pad is getting over heated and maybe “melting” a bit.

Here is what I would try - buy a set of the DTC60 pads, bed them in and run them on the street for a little while - normal driving. This should clean off the rotors and save them. The DTC60 pads are very agressive when not up to temperature and will be pretty affective at “machining” the deposits off the rotors. Then I would run those at your next event at LRP. NOTE! The DTC60 pads were not good for me at Palmer. They never got hot enough to be in their operating band and they machined away a set of rotors in a day and a half of running there. If I go there again, I will use a less agressive pad.

I am signed up for the Patroon’s event at LRP on 5/17

 

At the suggestion of Way Motor Works, I got Stage 1 with a high-flow downpipe. I was concerned about reliability and this was the balance they recommended after I explained what I was looking for.

That's exactly how it felt — like the rotors were badly warped. But it didn't get bad until the brakes were hot so it's possible melting is the answer. On the way home I slammed the brakes a few times and they were fine. The pads were Poly B. I got them when I bought the calipers a few years ago and never used them so I figured what the heck. I have always used Carbotech or G-Loc and have been very pleased with them. The G-Locs were on the rear. I'll probably just go back to them.

I'll take a look at dates this week and let you know.

 

After I posted my question, I remembered that you had said you had gotten the stage 1. Thanks for the reminder. That is what I would go with.

The Poly B and Poly H are similar pads, just a difference in how they perform with temperature rise. Still, I would get a set of DTC60s and run them on the street to scrap off the Wilwood pad deposits before putting on the Carbotech or G-Lok pads. For those I would jump up to the XP12s. That is what slinger used and liked over the XP10s.

Who have you been buying your Carbotech and G-Lock pads from?

 

I've been buying from brakeswap.com. Do you happen to have the DTC60 Model #s for the Wilwood front caliper and the MINI OEM rear? DTC60s are now your preferred track pads, correct? Maybe I'll just try a few days with them.
UPDATE: I just watched the video from the last few laps of the third session. It looked like I was going over rumble strips!

 

Eddie,

How long does the Hawk DTC-60 last with the Wilwood 11.75 for you? My last experience with a set of Hawk pads for the standard R56 calipers were most unpleasant. They threw off brake dusts that deposited onto the rim and was impossible to remove except by mechanical means. There were lightly used HT-14 that I got for a bargain price.

Seems the DTC-60 is reasonably price at just under $100 a set for the front in Wilwood 7816 form factors. It amazes me that how much cheaper are pads for the Wilwood form factors compared to the OEM counterparts. Also who do you get your DTC-60 from? You can PM me if not a supporting vendor here.

I have a feeling I need to have a couple sets of pads at the ready.

 

I'm not sure where Eddie 07S gets his DTC60s but when I asked Eric at brakeswap.com for a price he said he can't offer good prices on Hawk and I should just go to amazon. Do any supporting vendors offer Hawks?

 

Like everything associated with going to the track, I have found that there are few absolutes, brake pads included. I wouldn't say that the DTC 60s are my go-to pad. It depends on the track I am going to.
For life, I used the DTC 60 pads at Watkins Glen (WGI) for a 2 day event. Then I used them at Lime Rock (LRP) for 1 day and at Palmer for a day and a half. They still have life in them.
Here are my brake pad observations:
- The DTC 60s are dusty and throw a lot of crap, including metal dust. Hawk pads will all do this, which is my understanding.
- I will use the DTC 60 on tracks where the brake temps are going to be high and beyond the abilities of the Wilwood pads, and where they will be in their proper operating range. WGI is a great example of where to use them. It is a brake killer track. The DTC 60s were good at LRP because of the front straight braking zone which puts a lot of heat into them. The DTC 60s were not good at Palmer. They literally ate the rotors. I am told that they didn't get to a high enough temperature there and at lower temperatures the DTC 60s become like a file, just grinding away the rotor. I will not do that again.
- I had good success with the Wilwood BP-30s at LRP and will be trying them again there. I would use the BP-30s at Palmer if I go there again.
- I have used the Wilwood Poly H at LRP with good success. The Poly H will probably be my backup pad for there and Palmer if I need to replace the BP-30s.
- I have not had a chance to try the Carbotechs on this car, although I would like to. If I were to try them I would go to the XP12s up front.

For rear pads, as you all probably realize by now, I am not a person who follows conventional wisdom. For rear brakes, that wisdom has been that they don't do anything, so anything for pads will work. Balance the pads by using a less agressive pad in the rear (e.g.: Carbotech XP-10s up front and XP-8s in the rear). My experience - not true; none of it...My thoughts for rear pads:
- In summary I have found that the more braking that I can put onto the rears, the better the front brakes are. While it may not make sense, having more braking on the rears holds the rear down and the car brakes flatter and I don't get the rear end wiggle (dance?) when braking hard. MINI has already balanced the brakes by the different size of rotors and brake pistons. Why change that balance with a less aggressive pad in the rear? The rear brakes can take on a lot more braking than you might think. Hence my move to the Hawk DTC 60 pads in the rear. When these wear out, I will probably go to a Carbotech XP 10 back there.
- I have used stock MINI pads in the rear - not a good experience. Never again.
- I have used Carbotech XP8s - nice pad, not enough braking and rear wasn't stable.
- I have used Hawk Blues - again not enough braking and rear wasn't stable. I think they went beyond their temp range and faded out. And they were dusty, dirty.

Here is where I went for the DTC 60 for the Wilwoods, and if I remember correctly, I got the rear pads here too:
https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pr...?Product=HB542

Hope this helps...

 

I can’t remember having nearly as much braking issues as you guys seem to have.....what’s happening? I used DT70 pads up front and OEM pads out back.......and never seemed to have an issue, other than beveling the front pads.

 

Hello S-Driver ...
Running the DT70 pads probably is the reason you didn’t have issues. Those would have worked well at LRP and WGI. The rest of us are using a lower level pad. Also you had a wel setup track car which may have gotten rid of the tendency for the wiggle that I have had..

Plus - did you even use the brakes?

Maybe we are reinventing the wheel here, but I do remember Slinger working on brake issues with his MINI. Maybe it is a bit of a Gen I vs Gen II issue. The Gen I just seems to be a better track car and maybe those cars responded better to the addition of the Wilwood BBK.

A lot of my brake issues came from the DTC traction control and the eLSD my car has vs a real LSD. I went through a lot of pads and rotors when I added the Wilwoods. What a PIA that was to work through those issues. As a result of working through those issues, I am likely way over thinking this...

 

I never had any problems until this past Saturday when I went out on a set of Wilwood pads I had sitting in the garage. I am going to go back to Carbotech and hopefully all will be right with the world again.

 

Just signed up. See you on the 17th.

 

Which run group did you sign up for?

My car goes into the dealer on Tuesday to get a new serpentine belt and a couple of oil leaks fixed. Then the new RE71Rs will go on to check out the new TPMS and to scuff them in before going out onto the track.