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  #26  
Old 02-25-2010, 08:18 AM
firetruck41 firetruck41 is offline
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Originally Posted by howsoonisnow1985 View Post
I only put 91 Chevron or occasional Texaco always.
I will stick in some 97 Sunoco or 100 VP Racing Fuel for track days.
And a small bottle of Techron 1 or 2 times a month.
I have only put bad gas 3 times, all 3 times were an almost outta gas emergency and I only put $5 bucks in until I could make it to the next Chevron/Texaco. I also use Sunoco 93 which is not Top Tier but good gas nevertheless.
1. Outside Chicago traveling across US
2. At the Dragon
3. In Utah traveling across US
You knew the gas was bad, but put it in your car three different times anyway? How did you know to only put $5, and how did you know it was bad before you put it in?


I have been driving a variety of German and Japanese vehicles for 20 years, I have always put in the cheapest possible gas of the correct octane. I have NEVER had a fuel problem, EVER.
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  #27  
Old 02-25-2010, 08:25 AM
Bigshot Bigshot is offline
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Originally Posted by -=gRay rAvEn=- View Post
Did your dealer happen to elaborate as to what "their managment" considers to be: top tier fuel.

Because at the fuel depot here off the coast various tanker trucks pull up for loading from same tank source and then distribute that same fuel to 90 percent of every name brand station as well as every mom and pop gas station in this area......

And last I checked, the OM says high octane fuel yes ? and does not stipulate as to what brand of fuel we are to patronize.

Are they really taking apart the engine to "clean it" ? Are they removing the upper cylinder head ? Is the warranty covering this ?


While the common gas tanker/pipeline is correct it is not the gas itself that is considered top tier it is the additive package. And that is added seperately from the gas in most cases.
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  #28  
Old 02-25-2010, 10:56 AM
gggmini gggmini is offline
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Thanks all for your feedback. Got my car back today and luckily they did not charge me a penny. I was told to stick to Sunoco gas, then Shell or Texaco (even though Sunoco US is not on the top tier list, only Sunoco Canada). They did inform me today that they replaced a fuel injector and a faulty high pressure fuel pump - can't imagine that was all due to *bad gas* but they didn't clarify for me and sent me on my way.
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  #29  
Old 02-25-2010, 11:11 AM
firetruck41 firetruck41 is offline
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Just in the short time I have been on the forum, it appears the high pressure fuel pump is a "problem" component. Probably not unique to you or "bad gas".
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  #30  
Old 02-25-2010, 11:35 AM
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howsoonisnow1985 howsoonisnow1985 is offline
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Originally Posted by firetruck41 View Post
You knew the gas was bad, but put it in your car three different times anyway? How did you know to only put $5, and how did you know it was bad before you put it in?
I have been driving a variety of German and Japanese vehicles for 20 years, I have always put in the cheapest possible gas of the correct octane. I have NEVER had a fuel problem, EVER.
I meant CHEAP gas, highest octane available. But right after I put in some Techroline.


I just really wish we had 93 or 94 octane here in CA.
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Last edited by howsoonisnow1985; 02-25-2010 at 11:45 AM.
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  #31  
Old 02-25-2010, 12:04 PM
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Do you do Seafoam treatments Robin? I have a JCW and am thinking of doing it at 10,000 miles then every 10,000 or so. I'm not 100% convinced there isn't some risk to it but the benefit (cleaning the valves) seems worth it.
My car only has about 12K miles on it (I commute on the internet). I haven't done the Seafoam yet, as I haven't noticed any degradation in engine performance. Seems that most reports of the problem are on cars with about 30K miles on them. So, I'm putting off the research and decision until later. I have been keeping an eye on the thread about Seafoam in the DIY Mods forum.
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  #32  
Old 02-25-2010, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by skeeter09MCS View Post
I actually have had bad gas...high percentage of water according to the dealer..the gas station paid for it...

I always use premium..usually BP 93, but what is considered TOP TIER?
I've had problems with BP in the past. My 1990 Integra is sensitive to ethanol content. It tends to cause it to die just after starting when warm, leaving me sitting in a parking lot with a car full of groceries. I've had this problem when using BP gas. When I only use Shell, the problem goes away.
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  #33  
Old 02-25-2010, 05:46 PM
miniclubman miniclubman is offline
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...and the brands that have top tier designation PAY for that designation. So, the gas you buy may be as good or better than the top tier brands, but it simply be a brand that does not PAY to participate in the top tier marketing.

I believe that the brands that participate in top tier are good brands, but don't assume that a brand not in top tier is an inferior brand.
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  #34  
Old 02-26-2010, 07:20 AM
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They still need to meet the minimum spec's for the additive package they have whether or not they pay for the designation.
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  #35  
Old 02-27-2010, 04:46 PM
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I just don't buy it, seen way too many local people that do the Beacon and Arco thing and end up with probs after several years. I'll stick to Chevron or Shell, maybe 1 million bucks would convince me to do otherwise.
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  #36  
Old 02-28-2010, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by miniclubman View Post
...and the brands that have top tier designation PAY for that designation. So, the gas you buy may be as good or better than the top tier brands, but it simply be a brand that does not PAY to participate in the top tier marketing.

I believe that the brands that participate in top tier are good brands, but don't assume that a brand not in top tier is an inferior brand.
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They still need to meet the minimum spec's for the additive package they have whether or not they pay for the designation.
A while ago the federal requirement for additives in gas was lowered. But some car manufacturers saw an increase in engine deposits. The Top Tier requirment has higher minimum standards than the fed law. So it's possible that non-top tier has less detergents and the like.

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  #37  
Old 02-28-2010, 10:41 AM
groogrux groogrux is offline
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Here in Toronto I filled up(Premium fuel)at one of the stations that would not be considered as a top tier gas retailer. After running a short while, the check engine light came on. Took it to the dealer, they claimed it ruined the fuel rails and they were replaced under warranty. Since then I've only used Shell fuel, which in Ontario contains zero ethanol(vPower only), and have had no problems.
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  #38  
Old 02-28-2010, 12:09 PM
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Top tier gas is a gimmick. Shell dilutes their fuels up to 10% with Ethanol. The best bet is to try several different brands and stick to that one that works. (Just make sure you run the highest octane available.)
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  #39  
Old 02-28-2010, 12:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by howsoonisnow1985 View Post
I meant CHEAP gas, highest octane available. But right after I put in some Techroline.


I just really wish we had 93 or 94 octane here in CA.
Some places in South Orange County have 93oct.
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  #40  
Old 03-01-2010, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by firetruck41 View Post
Sounds like BS from the dealer...
I agree, the highest octane gas should be enough. If you still have a problem, it's not coming from what you're putting in the tank.
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  #41  
Old 03-01-2010, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by jd3544 View Post
Top tier gas is a gimmick. Shell dilutes their fuels up to 10% with Ethanol. The best bet is to try several different brands and stick to that one that works. (Just make sure you run the highest octane available.)

Lots areas have Shell gas with NO ethanol..............like mine.

You might want to do a little reading before making these kinds of erroneous statements.
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  #42  
Old 03-01-2010, 07:16 AM
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I agree, the highest octane gas should be enough. If you still have a problem, it's not coming from what you're putting in the tank.


If the gas has contaminents, too much ethanol, not enough additives they can cause problems regardless of octane.

These are the problems with some of the off brands of gas....
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  #43  
Old 03-01-2010, 09:58 AM
miniclubman miniclubman is offline
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The bottom line is that the OP's issue was not related to the gas he used.

It was a fuel pump failure, and the "bad gas" initial dealer claim was just so much dealer b.s.

When all else fails, blame the customer!
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  #44  
Old 03-01-2010, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Bigshot View Post
If the gas has contaminents, too much ethanol, not enough additives they can cause problems regardless of octane.

These are the problems with some of the off brands of gas....
Fair enough Bigshot, that makes sense. That's not something we have a problem with up here (since we pretty much only deal with Irving, Shell or Esso....plus I believe that something like 80% is produced by Irving or Esso across the whole Country, so it's a consistent blend), so other than the occasional water contaminated tank of bad gas, it's not something we think about.

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  #45  
Old 03-02-2010, 06:40 AM
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Sounds like another creative way GM is trying to generate much-needed revenue. I would get goose bumps to think that anyone here really believes that GM's not bought and paid for by the oil companies, for spcifically recommending certain "brands" of gasoline as "top-tier"...PLEASE!! I believe that if corrupt corporate empires like GM and the oil company mobsters can capitalize on consumers' brand-identity inferiority-complexes, then those cunsumers deserve to pay unfair premiums for their naivety. ...Just like those who pay extra for Evian bottled water (which actually spells "naive" backwards)...
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  #46  
Old 03-02-2010, 06:59 AM
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Where's my foil hat when I need it...........
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  #47  
Old 03-02-2010, 08:22 AM
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While I sure that there is a marketing component to the whole Top Tier thing...

if you look at the history of why it came to be there was a real reason. The refiners wanted to save money and got the feds to lower the minimum detergent levels for gasoline. That is true. Auto manufacturers noticed an increase in gunk and warranty issues. That is true. They got together to do the Top Tier thing. If you get past all the BS, Top Tier requires two things:
  • Not less than 8% and not more than 10% ethanol.
  • Higher levels of detergents than the federal standard.
One can debate about the market manipulations and the like that go into becoming a "top tier" gas supplier and who makes money from what. But this is the history and the differences between what any gas station can do and what a Top Tier gasoline supplier can do. Personally, I like the higher level of detergents, and don't like the ethanol content. I actually don't care as I do other things to make sure that the deposites in my engine are dealt with.

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  #48  
Old 03-02-2010, 10:53 AM
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You buy your gas at Mobil and Hess? Those ARENT top tier?

I get my gas anywhere, I never cared. Alot of time its the really crappy ones. I call complete BS on that. I have friends who told me that all gas stations get their gas from the same places. A friend told me he knew someone who delivered gas and he said they deliver all the same stuff to any station.

I dont care what they say, gasoline shouldn't gunk up an engine on a nearly new car.
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  #49  
Old 03-02-2010, 11:11 AM
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The gas starts from the same large tank

the additive mixture is added en route to the specific gas station. Think what you want, but low mixtures of detergent will increase deposit formation rates. Is that a problem or just something that requires some attention? That one is open for debate....

Matt
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  #50  
Old 03-04-2010, 12:01 PM
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I don't doubt that bad gas exists, but I do doubt that it is to blame for as many problems that are reported here.
I am glad that the gas station paid in your case.
That is why I think that whenever bad gas is diagnosed as the cause of a problem, the gas station should be involved as well.
Really, there should be no such thing as bad gas from any licensed station that has passed regulation requirements.

In your case, did the station correct the problem that caused them to be selling bad gas?

I don't know what constitutes Top-Tier either.

I do know that my dealer uses low cost gas in the cars that they sell.
No one told me that the brand of gas mattered, only that I should use premium.
My dealer said there was a high percentage of water in my tank. I filled up at about 11pm, at Sunoco, drove about 1/4 mile and my car died. The next morning the pumps were limited to 87 only(see below pics). After my going to the station about 3 times a day for about 4 days, their insurance contacted me. They paid for the repairs. Not sure if they fixed their problem..i have never been back. Also note in the pic, there is no department of agriculture foil sticker on the pump. I didnt notice that when i got the gas.
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Old 03-04-2010, 12:01 PM
 
 
 
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