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So I was at the dealer the other day getting the AC fixed under warranty and they said I needed to get the power steering flushed along with the fuel injectors flushed. I figured the fuel injector flush was BS, but I figured with all the problems people have with the power steering pump, that the power steering flush might be something important to get done.
After searching on here I couldnt find anybody else who has done this, or at least written some type of instructions other then 'take the hose off, move tires side to side, replace hose and fill' from over a year ago.
So my question, is this something that needs to be done or is the dealer trying to take my money, they conveniently told me right after my service warranty expired.
The PS fluid is mineral oil based and as such is not hydroscopic. If the PS pump is operating properly then there should be no particulates in the fluid therefore the service suggested is total BS.
Most BMW/MINI fluids are considered lifetime fluids. But the PS fluid gets kind of dark and merky looking after a while. The cars have not been out long enough to tell if the old fluid could cause a problem but in never hurts to change it.
Also, there is a fuel system flush that MINI offers. It hooks directly to your fuel rail and with the amount of carbon build up these days is also not a bad idea. Maintenance can be expense but the results of not doing any can cost more.
Doing either of these items certainly won't hurt your MINI, just your wallet.
I run a bottle of Techron through my fuel system at every oil change, 6,000 miles for me. If I was having issues that pointed to dirty injectors I might spring for that service. If the OP is not he shouldn't.
As far as a the PS flush. Well it may be lifetime fluid, but it will pick up contaminates over time. When my MINI reaches 100,000 I will change the fluid.
I stand by my earlier post that these services are just a cash cow for the dealer.
Thanks for the responses. I'm always good about maintenance, but just wanted to see if it was something that HAD to be done. I am getting ready to change the oil, filters and brakes and wanted to see if I needed to add this to the list. I looked at the fluid the other day and it still has a nice neon green color to it, so I'm not too concerned with it at the moment.
For the future, has anybody here changed out the power steering fluid before and can offer up some advice? Will 1 liter of fluid work?
I know a lot of people have changed out the power steering pump, but I'm hoping this is a lot easier then that.
My 02 MCS Power Steering fan probably quit working several months ago however, I did not realize this until I drove it from NJ to FL in the Summer. Because the P/S fan and the engine's cooling fan are on the same 5 amp circuit, my car began to overheat in the Summer Florida sun (96 degrees). This fried my A/C compressor. Looking for something more serious than a P/S fan, I replaced the cooling fan first ($319 dealer part) and then the A/C compressor ($270 remanufactured). The car overheated again and in the process, I lost my power steering. http://www.northamericanmotoring.com...milies/mad.gif
It was only now that I diagnosed the problem to be the P/S fan ($116 aftermarket). The "lifetime" fluid you are referring to is made in Germany, Pentosin CHF 11S ($26 per liter) and available through either Mini or BMW.
I'm praying that the P/S pump was not damaged and that a power steering flush and a new fan will make things all better. While I'm waiting for my fan, I disconnected the fluid pressure pipe to drain the fluid, but it barely drips out. Any suggestions how I can completely drain the pump?
The PS fluid is mineral oil based and as such is not hydroscopic. If the PS pump is operating properly then there should be no particulates in the fluid therefore the service suggested is total BS.
P/S fluid for the Mini is Pentosin CHF-11S. According to the label on the can, it is synthetic and operates within the temperature range of -40*C / 130*C. It can be found from other sources for much cheaper than the dealers.
The design of the Mini P/S pump (electro-hydraulic + electric cooling fan) seems to be "at the last minute" deal. They put both the pump and cooling fan behind the engine and downpipe, where most of the heat is concentrated. The fan is 6-7" above the ground and faces downward to catch road debris and trash. They should send the guy who designed this to Gitmo.
To flush or not??? I've not done it for my Mini yet with 30k on the clock. But I would just to replenish the additive content of the lubricant to keep the rubber seals soft.
The proper way - disconnect the return line to drain the old fluid while pouring new fluid into the reservoir. This is a 2 person deal... one person turns the steering wheel to activate the P/S pump while another pours new fluid into the reservoir. It requires 2-3 liters to make sure all the old fluid is out... just like flushing the automatic transmission. You'll have a cleaner system doing a full flush.
The cheap & lazy way - I've done partial drain & refills on my VW New Beetle which also has Pentosin CHF-11S. Using a turkey baster I extract all the fluid from the reservoir and refill to the correct level. For the NB, only about 50% of the fluid (1/2 liter) is replaced with this method. So in effect this is only a partial flush. But I do this every other year or so to keep the fluid semi-fresh. My method is easier/cheaper and it has worked fine so far. The P/S in my NB is absolutely silent with no leaks at 156k. It's better designed though... the P/S in front of the engine with its own radiator at the front grill. No fan necessary.
Good info. We too were advised that even though our '06 with 39k on it has extended maintenance, tires, P/S fluid flush, and Fuel Injector Flush is NOT covered and is "recommended every 30k miles". (Oh, at a cost of roughly $400 for both services!)
Seems kind of odd to flush the P/S fluid every 30k (or 2 years).
I worked in a dealership ( non Mini) for many years.Flushes were a huge money maker.Many of the service advisors would recieve bonuses for selling them
Last edited by wewantamini; 09-03-2009 at 05:55 PM.
Good info. We too were advised that even though our '06 with 39k on it has extended maintenance, tires, P/S fluid flush, and Fuel Injector Flush is NOT covered and is "recommended every 30k miles". (Oh, at a cost of roughly $400 for both services!)
Seems kind of odd to flush the P/S fluid every 30k (or 2 years).
$400 is too much. You should do it yourself and it shouldn't cost more than $40 for both fluids. Injector flush is the biggest hoax. Most dealer suggest it every 30k or 40k. Just buy a bottle of Techron or Redline SI and add it to a full tank of gas. Drive the car hard for the next 300 miles... do a few Italian tune-ups (high RPM). I usually do this once a year and have never had problems with injectors from my 4 cars going back to 1981.
P/S: Like I said, a full flush is a bit extreme. I would extract the fluid from the reservoir and add fresh fluid to the correct level. The oil itself doesn't break down that easily but the additives will. Additives keep the rubber seals from drying, neutralize acid, slow down corrosion. By adding new fluid, you're basically replenishing the additives.
BTW you can get Pentosin CHF 11S at NAPA for $20/qt.
If a person was going to do a drain (open return line, drain, left and right, etc.) Does anyone know how much is needed to refill? And what kind of fitting does that return hose hose have? (Any seals, O-rings, special gaskets, etc on that fitting?).
Because the P/S fan and the engine's cooling fan are on the same 5 amp circuit, my car began to overheat in the Summer Florida sun (96 degrees). This fried my A/C compressor.
I don't understand why that would have affected the compressor. Please explain.
My 02 mini cooper is having power steering problems maybe someone has some answers. When my car is turned on it makes a sort of wizzing sounds not too loud but noticeable. Then it clicks periodically when I turn while at the same time stiff. Then I drove from seacoast NH to cape cod MA and almost 30 Mins from my power steering cut out completely. Figured my pump went. But my fluid is full and no leak. Then I left it for the night and started it in the morn and it went back to how it had been Leaving Nh.
Hoping its not the pump. But figuring it is. Anyone please let me know I am leaving for CA in 10 days. And need to fix it. And don't wanna get it diagnosed
My 02 mini cooper is having power steering problems maybe someone has some answers. When my car is turned on it makes a sort of wizzing sounds not too loud but noticeable. Then it clicks periodically when I turn while at the same time stiff. Then I drove from seacoast NH to cape cod MA and almost 30 Mins from my power steering cut out completely. Figured my pump went. But my fluid is full and no leak. Then I left it for the night and started it in the morn and it went back to how it had been Leaving Nh.
Hoping its not the pump. But figuring it is. Anyone please let me know I am leaving for CA in 10 days. And need to fix it. And don't wanna get it diagnosed
Drive down and see Pete at Greassy's in worchester Ma...he works on lots of mini's...
Sounds like the ps pump is bad..rebuilds are possible, but safest thing to do is a new one. Rebuilds are ok, but since yous fails from heat, the windings in the motor or the electronics could be bad, and nether of these items is replaced during the rebuilds...
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l 2005 MCS l 11-04 Production l owned since new l RMW Tuned l Craven -17% Pulley l Craven Speed STD l Dinan CAI l JCW 380's l H&R 19 MM Swaybar l MSD Ignition l Power Steering Fan Duct l LightInSight l "EURO" MINI Armrest l Euro Parcel Shelf l Brake Light PULSAR(gen2)l Detroit Tuned Tensioner Stop l Blitzsafe/xmradio l Cobra 19IV CB l 4.5' Francis CB25 CB Antenna, mounted on the rear tow rig!!
Ever since I did a flush and fill, my p/s pump hasn't failed. This is probably a "band-aid" solution to a much more expensive R&R on the pump. Keeping my fingers crossed.
I think when these pumps fail it is the electric motor in the pump not the actual pump that goes. Flushing your fluid, while it makes you feel good that you are being nice to your MINI most likely has no effect on the life of the electric power steering.
I think when these pumps fail it is the electric motor in the pump not the actual pump that goes. Flushing your fluid, while it makes you feel good that you are being nice to your MINI most likely has no effect on the life of the electric power steering.
+1
Many folks say flushing can actually cause issues....it can free up deposits that have formed in the system, and then they float around, causing more wear....heck, the deposits, if they are in the right spots MAY be helping you by preventing leaks...
The safest thing to do by far is to change, not flush the fluid.... for what it gets you, IMO, just freshen the fluid with the mentioned 50% method!! I have done it with a Siphon hose (in a different car, very carefully). Turkey baster from the dollar store would actually work better!!
When the pumps fail, usually by cutting in and out, it is usually a problem, by most accounts, with the windings in the motor, or the electronics....components that are not supposedly fixed during a rebuild....remember they are REBUILT, not manufactured....they are opened up, cleaned, and new bushings installed, closed up, and tested!! If the windings in the motor are failing from heat (the wires coatings fail over time, just like in a generator, from exposure to heat, or excessive heat!!), the only solution is to rewind it, or replace it...a cleaning will not help.
To make the pump more reliable, it must be kept cool...working PS fan, maybe a cooler to keep the fluid cool..so it might act as a heat sink perhaps....this fluid stands up to high temps very well, but the pumps motor does not!!
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l 2005 MCS l 11-04 Production l owned since new l RMW Tuned l Craven -17% Pulley l Craven Speed STD l Dinan CAI l JCW 380's l H&R 19 MM Swaybar l MSD Ignition l Power Steering Fan Duct l LightInSight l "EURO" MINI Armrest l Euro Parcel Shelf l Brake Light PULSAR(gen2)l Detroit Tuned Tensioner Stop l Blitzsafe/xmradio l Cobra 19IV CB l 4.5' Francis CB25 CB Antenna, mounted on the rear tow rig!!
I'm bringin it back!
I would say change the fluid!
When I bought my 03 MCS (135k)I had no idea what to look for and 3 months after i bought it the steering pump failed so I took it out and tore it apart to have a looksy. It was pretty nasty inside the motor housing as well as the pump. A local guy in the KC MINI club took it to his shop and worked his magic and it has been working great 13k miles later.
I'm bringin it back!
I would say change the fluid!
When I bought my 03 MCS (135k)I had no idea what to look for and 3 months after i bought it the steering pump failed so I took it out and tore it apart to have a looksy. It was pretty nasty inside the motor housing as well as the pump. A local guy in the KC MINI club took it to his shop and worked his magic and it has been working great 13k miles later.
The Comutator was machined down, bearings replaced and whole thing cleaned. We were unable to find a source for the correct brushes otherwise those would have been replaced as well although they still have some life left in them.
