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  #1  
Old 10-11-2007, 06:54 PM
Jinxy Jinxy is offline
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Need everyone's help: blazing HOT bonnet problem MINI/BMW won't fix!

Hi everyone,

Quote:
* * * * * * * * P L E A S E - O N L Y - P O S T - I N - T H I S - T H R E A D * * * * * * * * *
----==== = = T O - R E P O R T - Y O U R - M I N I - H A S - T H I S - P R O B L E M
----==== = = A N D - A N Y - A C T I O N S - T A K E N (with dealer or Mini/BMW or NHTSA).

.
.
O N L Y - P O S T - O N C E, - then continue to update your original post to provide updates.
.
General Discussion should be posted here.
I started a similar thread in the Mini2 forums and as suggested by others, thought I should re-start one here with concise directions on how to test your MCSm for the problem.

Many '07 MCSm owners are not aware that their bonnet area just above the scoop can reach temperatures of 235F. This was measured with an IR temp gun. I have also used a temperature probe to verify the temperatures just inside the scoop. It has reached 280F .

Some owners have begun experiencing warped/melted/deformed scoops due to this extreme heat issue. I am experiencing the weeping washer jets issue. Both of these problems are being caused by the ridiculous amount of heat under the bonnet after the car is parked. My scoop is the newer model grill that has every other column open.

The bonnet gets hot enough to cause second degree burns. It is important to follow all the steps outlined below. Here are the conditions and how to test you MCSm:
  1. Drive you Mini for 10 minutes or more.
  2. Park your Mini, turn off the engine.
  3. Remember to exercise extreme caution when touching this area of your bonnet as you can be BURNED.
  4. Initially check bonnet, 1/4 inch above the center of the scoop (where the scoop ends and bonnet begins again.) It will only feel slightly warm at this time.
  5. Wait 5 minutes and check the same area again, it will be hot.
  6. Check again each subsequent minutes after that.
    The temperature continues to increase until peaking as high as
    235F.
Please take into account the environment you are testing in. It is most noticeable while parked in a garage, with no air movement. Depending what direction your car is facing, if it's a nice breezy day, your temperature results may be much lower.

My temporary solution, until Mini/BMW acknowledges and resolves this problem, is to use a desk fan in the garage to keep the temperatures from breaking 200F.

I don't know if this is only affecting US MCSm's or other countries as well. Mini/BMW has been aware of this issue, as it was reported on NAM 7 months ago. Yet they have done nothing to resolve it.

The cause of the weeping washer jet is easy to identify. During a drive, use your washer jets. When you park, verify there are no fluid stains on your bonnet. By the time you get to step 6, from the steps outlined above, your washer jets will have begun weeping down your bonnet. Water boils at 212F. The temps under my bonnet are reaching 200-300F. The water is expanding (or steaming) out of the washer lines due to this heat.

The Mini/BMW techs I have spoken with indicate that Mini/BMW will most likely come out with a check valve to resolve the weeping washer jet issue. That does not address the heat issue.

All that is required is for Mini/BMW to update the ECU software to run the coolant fan and turbo water pump longer after the vehicle is shut down. A check valve may also be required for the washer jets, but not by itself.

'07 MCSm owners need to start making more noise regarding this extreme heat issue.

Any family member, adult, child or passerby that may happen to touch your bonnet in the “hot zone” will surly burn themselves.

Please bring this problem to you service advisor's attention and demand that Mini/BMW fix this problem.

Also, please report this safety issue to NHTSA if it affects your Mini.

Thank You, and be careful.

RESOLUTIONS
10/12/07 - Regretfully had a check valve installed to stop washer jets from weeping.
10/12/07 - Dealer ordered new fender trim due to permanent cosmoline stain.


Quote:
* * * * * * * * P L E A S E - O N L Y - P O S T - I N - T H I S - T H R E A D * * * * * * * * *
----==== = = T O - R E P O R T - Y O U R - M I N I - H A S - T H I S - P R O B L E M
----==== = = A N D - A N Y - A C T I O N S - T A K E N (with dealer or Mini/BMW or NHTSA)


O N L Y - P O S T - O N C E, - then continue to update your original post to provide updates.

General Discussion should be posted here.
.
.

.
__________________
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Ordered 6/29 -- Delivered 8/1
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Last edited by Jinxy; 10-14-2007 at 03:35 PM.
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  #2  
Old 10-11-2007, 09:12 PM
mataku mataku is offline
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PLEASE only post if you have the problem and probably best to keep a single post for yourself and just update as you need to.

Here is a link to the thread for discussion of this problem, if you need that. Keep this thread for those with the actual issue and just as a place for documentation.

http://northamericanmotoring.com/for...=1#post1800821


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2007 MCS 6 speed. Week 34 build, picked up early 10/2007.

Temperature is fine right after turning off the engine, fan runs for about 20 seconds after turning it off. After ten minutes bonnet around scoop area gets too hot to keep my hand there.

10/11/2007 Discovered Problem. Scoop too hot to keep hand there. Scoop not yet deformed.

Actions taken:
10/12/2007 emailed MA None yet. Plan of action: call in to SA for appointment to check car out. If nothing resolves, contact NHTSA and MINIUSA.
10/19/2007 emailed CustomerRelations@bmwusa.com

Will update as soon as update is available.
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Last edited by mataku; 10-19-2007 at 09:42 AM.
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Old 10-12-2007, 04:37 AM
korby korby is offline
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I've had this from day one .I brought it in to be looked at and was told it was normal even though he could not keep his hand on the hot spot for more than a second .He also said he had never heard this complaint before .
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Old 10-12-2007, 05:21 AM
Coffeeman Coffeeman is offline
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Same problem here. I doubt that MINI is going to do anything about this, until they are sued by someone who has burned themselves.
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  #5  
Old 10-12-2007, 05:31 AM
Yucca Patrol Yucca Patrol is offline
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Maybe they need to adopt the same strategy as McDonald's did when they had that great McDLT with their special packaging to make sure the "hot stays hot and the cool stays cool"?

Click the image to open in full size.
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  #6  
Old 10-12-2007, 07:44 AM
Jinxy Jinxy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coffeeman View Post
Same problem here. I doubt that MINI is going to do anything about this, until they are sued by someone who has burned themselves.
Eeewwwww! Do I smell a class action suit coming?

Also, Please, please, please post all responses here http://northamericanmotoring.com/for...=1#post1800821

Thanks!

Last edited by Jinxy; 10-12-2007 at 07:47 AM.
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  #7  
Old 10-12-2007, 10:23 AM
Rastven Rastven is offline
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I have the heat issue with weeping washers. I'm going to bring it up when I go to get a few things fixed next week.

2007 MCS 6 speed. Week 33 build, picked up early 9/2007.

Fan runs for 20-30 secs, pump sounds for a couple of mins at most
Heat builds after 5-10 mins sitting.

Plan: Contact dealer re other repair 10/15ish and will see how it goes from there.
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Last edited by Rastven; 10-12-2007 at 01:12 PM.
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  #8  
Old 10-12-2007, 10:45 AM
Partsman Partsman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinxy
Hi everyone,

I started a similar thread in the Mini2 forums and as suggested by others, thought I should re-start one here with concise directions on how to test your MCSm for the problem.
Sorry, I have nothing to offer in this thread. I was just wondering what the "m" is for in MCSm?
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  #9  
Old 10-12-2007, 10:58 AM
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daffodildeb daffodildeb is online now
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Manual (transmission).
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First MINI: Zippeee! '07 MCS, 6-spd, CR/W, delivered 2/21/07 103,000 miles of non-commuting fun! Now for sale...

Second MINI: (no name yet) '15 MCS, 6-spd, WS/W, delivered 10/14/14. Checked just about all the boxes...
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  #10  
Old 10-12-2007, 11:14 AM
Partsman Partsman is offline
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Originally Posted by daffodildeb View Post
Manual (transmission).
Thanks.
I've never seen the MCS with the manual trans described like that. I'm used to just seeing MCS for the manual and MCSa for the automatic.

Sorry to sway from the original topic, Jinxy. BTW, I would imagine the issue is present in the automatic as well. yes?/no?
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  #11  
Old 10-12-2007, 12:59 PM
Rastven Rastven is offline
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Doesn't seem to be Partsman, at least not from what I have seen/heard. Weird that only the manual would be affected, maybe we drive it harder, lol.
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  #12  
Old 10-12-2007, 01:15 PM
korby korby is offline
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Thank you for making this a sticky! I've become exausted trying to keep this issue in the forefront ,Arnbut helped for a while and was rewarded with a new car .Jinxy has been a great help but I can tell he's getting frustrated .I have a hard time believing its not an issue for every R56 S.
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Old 10-12-2007, 03:40 PM
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I think that BMW/MINI is taking a real leap with their new turbo cars (Mini Cooper S / BMW 335, etc.).

Living with a turbo allows for glimpses of heaven and glimpses of hell. Turbos, by their nature, get incredibly hot at start-up and shut-down. All heat rises so what you're feeling is the remaining heat from what may be as much as 600F at the turbo bearing.

Turbos need to be cooled down prior to shut-down. It isn't rocket science, just basic physics. All owners of 07 Cooper S would be wise to read up on this as I doubt that Mini addresses the subject completely in their manual. If it makes you feel better, BMW 335 owners are screaming about heat issues in their cars as well.

Now, none of this means that Mini shouldn't be insulating that point where the heat is focused. That should come as no surprise since Mini doesn't want to cop to windshield, strut tower, and other issues either.

Denial ain't just a river in Egypt.

Good luck.
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Old 10-12-2007, 07:55 PM
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I have had the weeping washer jets on my bonnet. It actually stained the bonnet stripes. I don't know what the temps are.

After driving for at least 10 minutes and allowing the car to sit the bonnet is too hot to touch just above the hood scoop. I can feel heat radiating out of the vents in my scoop. I'll keep an eye on this thread for resolutions, but I'm two hours away from my dealership so I probably won't just drive down and show them so they can say there is nothing they can do about it.
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Last edited by Teach; 10-13-2007 at 01:32 PM. Reason: add to it
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Old 10-12-2007, 10:11 PM
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Ok,
I think these IR scanners belong in the wife's kitchen for checking the Turkey. The bonnet is hot to touch. The engine is hot to touch. The turbo is close to the hood which makes it hot. We all bought a PERFORMANCE car.
The engine will be hot, the turbo will make it hotter. The exhaust tips will burn you. Should we have the GOV step in and place big yellow warning stickers next to these? Please keep your children and loved ones away from these areas.

I live in South Korea. I don't appreciate people "touching" my vehicles. Mostly because we get a lot of dust and when "touching" they tend to leave a mark. Requiring cleaning on my part.

I have a motorcycle here. The engine and exhaust is exposed, and will likely burn your skin off. I have had many Koreans (they love to touch things lol) burn thierselves "touching" my exhaust tips, and then complain. My friend has an 07S and recently burned his ankle on the exhaust tips. Guess what. It's very hot. Suprise.

Sorry......Is any of this in the MINI Owner's Manual? If not, common sense should direct you...........:impatient
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Old 10-12-2007, 11:05 PM
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Mine's hot. Reported to NHTSA.

And I think there's a difference between burning yourself on your car's hood/bonnet and touching the exhaust tips of a motorcycle.
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Old 10-12-2007, 11:48 PM
r56mini r56mini is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seoulski View Post
Ok,
I think these IR scanners belong in the wife's kitchen for checking the Turkey. The bonnet is hot to touch. The engine is hot to touch. The turbo is close to the hood which makes it hot. We all bought a PERFORMANCE car.
The engine will be hot, the turbo will make it hotter. The exhaust tips will burn you. Should we have the GOV step in and place big yellow warning stickers next to these? Please keep your children and loved ones away from these areas.

I live in South Korea. I don't appreciate people "touching" my vehicles. Mostly because we get a lot of dust and when "touching" they tend to leave a mark. Requiring cleaning on my part.

I have a motorcycle here. The engine and exhaust is exposed, and will likely burn your skin off. I have had many Koreans (they love to touch things lol) burn thierselves "touching" my exhaust tips, and then complain. My friend has an 07S and recently burned his ankle on the exhaust tips. Guess what. It's very hot. Suprise.

Sorry......Is any of this in the MINI Owner's Manual? If not, common sense should direct you...........:impatient
Tell that to the guy with a deformed hood scoop. The car is damaging itself from its own heat. That is wrong. What would you say if your pressure rice cooker exploded? It uses high pressure so is that OK in your book as well?
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Old 10-13-2007, 04:37 AM
Rastven Rastven is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seoulski View Post
Ok,
I think these IR scanners belong in the wife's kitchen for checking the Turkey. The bonnet is hot to touch. The engine is hot to touch. The turbo is close to the hood which makes it hot. We all bought a PERFORMANCE car.
The engine will be hot, the turbo will make it hotter. The exhaust tips will burn you. Should we have the GOV step in and place big yellow warning stickers next to these? Please keep your children and loved ones away from these areas.

I live in South Korea. I don't appreciate people "touching" my vehicles. Mostly because we get a lot of dust and when "touching" they tend to leave a mark. Requiring cleaning on my part.

I have a motorcycle here. The engine and exhaust is exposed, and will likely burn your skin off. I have had many Koreans (they love to touch things lol) burn thierselves "touching" my exhaust tips, and then complain. My friend has an 07S and recently burned his ankle on the exhaust tips. Guess what. It's very hot. Suprise.

Sorry......Is any of this in the MINI Owner's Manual? If not, common sense should direct you...........:impatient
Tell it to my gf and her Audi 2.0T quattro. I can drive the hell out of that car, whch has a bigger turbo than we do, and the bonnet doesn't increase in temp a single degree.
Now I know that the MINI is smaller in terms of engine bay but the bonnet heat is ridiculous and getting hot enough to boil an alcohol based washer solution is also nuts. We all understand that engines get hot but that heat shouldn't be "vented" out via conduction thru the hood. It should be dealt with thru increased fan and cooling pump run time, a simple software fix.
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07 MCS, CR/W, DSC, LSD, Xenons, Cold Weather package, MSFW, Bluetooth, S-Winders - She's all mine.

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Old 10-13-2007, 08:50 AM
TheOfficeMaven TheOfficeMaven is offline
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What bugs me is how hot the car gets inside down by the gas pedal. My shoe feels like it's going to light on fire after a really long drive. A bit ridiculous if you ask me.

EDIT: To conform to the thread I've edited this message to add that our brand new week 34 build MCS has this problem as well. The hood temp is fine until the car is shut off for around five minutes or so and then the hood/bonnet becomes too hot to touch around the scoop area.

Last edited by TheOfficeMaven; 10-13-2007 at 05:00 PM.
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Old 10-13-2007, 11:09 AM
rkw rkw is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOfficeMaven View Post
What bugs me is how hot the car gets inside down by the gas pedal. My shoe feels like it's going to light on fire after a really long drive. A bit ridiculous if you ask me.
That's an issue that has come up on both NAM and MINI2:
http://www.northamericanmotoring.com...d.php?t=112726
http://www.mini2.com/forum/2nd-gen-f...nside-car.html
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  #21  
Old 10-13-2007, 11:39 AM
mataku mataku is offline
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PLEASE.... pretty pretty please, keep this thread for reports ONLY!

Here is a thread for discussion, we don't need 3-4 of the same threads, so please try and keep the threads for their purpose instead of mixing them up.
http://northamericanmotoring.com/for...=1#post1800821


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  #22  
Old 10-16-2007, 12:32 PM
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I am having under the hood heat problems to (no hood deformations yet). But what do you do just make an appointment with the service department and say" Its too hot under my hood, can you fix that please?" I mean is it just that easy? or are they going to laugh at me and tell me just to take my hood off? and ps the cosmiline(yellow goo) is linked to this problem and the weeping washer jets. That stuff gets so hot as well and just leeks out.

Brandon
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Old 10-17-2007, 07:26 PM
dirkinoff dirkinoff is offline
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Hey I gotta idea Dont touch the hood scoop after you have been driving it!! Also be careful the brake rotors are hot also, Plus that snail looking item just under the hood scoop that has the international sign for "dont touch" dont touch that either.
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Old 10-17-2007, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by dirkinoff View Post
Hey I gotta idea Dont touch the hood scoop after you have been driving it!! Also be careful the brake rotors are hot also, Plus that snail looking item just under the hood scoop that has the international sign for "dont touch" dont touch that either.
HA! my thoughts exactly. if there is no damage to the car as a result of the heat (i do realize some are having the hood scoop melt a bit) , then WHO CARES!!
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Old 10-18-2007, 02:52 PM
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My Mini seems to have this issue. It's a Cooper S purchased on October 6th, despite being built way back in February (strange, I know).

After turning off the car the fan does not seem to run at all. The quiet electric hissing noise (water pump?) continues to operate for a few minutes before it shuts off. Immediately after shutting off the car the hood above the scoop is hot, but I can hold my hand there (with some discomfort... I want to pull it away). After a few minutes the hood in that location is too hot to keep my hand there for more than 2-3 seconds. My scoop is completely blocked with no open holes. I also have a clear bra that was installed by the dealer (which is probably melted to the hood ). I have not experienced the washer fluid leaking, but then I haven't really used the washers. The scoop is still intact with no obvious signs of deformation (yet). The car has less than 500kms on it so far (about 312 miles).

The only action I have taken so far is that I have taken pictures of the scoop in case it begins to deform, so that I can have before and after pictures. Oh, and I have plans to call the dealer about the engine fan fuse, having discovered that mine is a 30A and must have missed the recall. For all I know the fan isn't operating at all.

Oh, I should also note that I park the car in a garage, and the outdoor temperature has been around 70 degrees.

UPDATE: My windshield washers do leak. I used them on the way home, just to see what would happen. Not long after shutting off the car the driver's side washer began to weep, and the passenger side wasn't far behind. They slowly leaked for about five minutes.

Last edited by Bishamon; 10-19-2007 at 02:34 PM. Reason: update
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