Ed, i thought you said earlier that you liked your car now that the clutch problem appears to have been resolved?? As JCWBlue noted, new models are bound to experience issues and it may take a couple of years to iron them out.

 

I do -- and I won't be looking to replace it now as soon as I previously thought. It's more of a growing dissatisfaction with MINI/BMW and decisions they've made since my first one. It's not just this car -- between my wife and me, this is our 5th MINI, and we've been progressively less enthused with each one. It's not that we dislike them, we just dislike more and more of the things they do with each new gen, and even from one model year to the next. Not trying to troll -- just not as thrilled with the brand in general as we once were.

 

Exactly how I feel! I'm actually considering the manic stage 1 tune. I was thinking of doing the JB+ but for a little more $$ it would be nice to have a real tune done. I've heard the manic tune is how this car should have come from the factory.

My Paceman is going to the dealer friday for oil change and for them to check out a squeaking noise coming from the clutch pedal. I'm going to mention my disappointment with the clutch and see if they've heard of many other paceman owners having similar thoughts.

I'll most likely end up buying it out of the lease next year, but it'll most likely be my last mini. I was pretty torn between the R61 and a WRX, however I went with the R61 because of how impressed I was with my '08 R56. Ohh what a horrible decision that was.

 

Do all you guys with clutch issues have four wheel drives?

 

I was referring to the Paceman only. The Paceman was a new model in 2013. Eds not-so-red complaint concerns a 2013 Paceman, doesn't it? I also read on this forum that the majority of all 2013 Paceman S's with AWD had a clutch issue. The fix as Eds not-so-red stated was a replacement consisting of a JCW clutch.

 

Interesting -- I had never seen that about manual All4 Paceman (not that it would have mattered, since I bought the first manual All4 Paceman my dealer received ... And the first Paceman of any kind in the state). I did see that the first year Countryman clutches had issues; but since they supposedly corrected it in later models, I assumed they would have applied those lessons to the Paceman, which shares drivetrains with the Countryman. What it seems that they did was use up all those leftover inferior clutches in the first year Paceman's.

But to answer your earlier post about first-year models, because the Paceman's underpinnings are the same as the Countryman's, it seemed like a safe assumption that the Paceman wouldn't have the usual first-year growing pains. Forgot that we're talking about BMW here, which typically defies logic and reason by doing things the way no one in the world would expect them to.

 

Mine's an All4, and I believe all the issues with the Countryman clutches were All4's, also. It makes sense, because with FWD, the drive wheels will spin before the clutch would slip. But all that extra traction of AWD is just too much for the same clutch. I can't believe that detail escaped the BMW propellerheads.

 

I searched other threads on this clutch issue and the majority of complaints were the same, people uncomfortable with the Countryman S and Paceman S clutches all the way up to 2013.

As you stated maybe BWW already had Pacemans built with the inferior clutches and decided to sell them anyway.

Another thing to take into consideration is that this forum is only a very small sampling of people with Problems concerning the clutch. We have no way of knowing how many people had problems. In my opinion there were a lot more then what we have viewed here.

 

I'm relatively new to the board and am waiting for my 2015 Paceman S ALL4. Its also a manual, so I am very much hoping the clutch problems you are mentioning were worked out with newer models. :-/

I already have my JB+ ready, so my fear is extra torque would likely only make that worse if it still exists. I test drove a 2015 Paceman S ALL4 twice and didn't experience any slipping. The shifter is a little sloppy, but fixable.

 

Considering all the internet exposure on this issue; I wouldn't worry about it. MINI knows it has or had a problem and it should have made the corrective actions by now.

As I stated my car is a 2014 JCW Paceman so I never had any problems; the problems were only on the S's.

 

The JCW has a 'beefier' clutch (that's how my SA described it), and that's what my dealer has been putting in to Paceman and Countryman All4's that have clutch issues. As I noted earlier, it made a huge difference. If MINI/BMW is smart, that's what they're putting in newer All4's.

 

Well as of today my Paceman is getting a new clutch and flywheel. Don't know if it's JCW parts going in or not, the SA wouldn't really tell me much.

A few weeks ago it developed a squeak from the clutch slave cylinder area when the clutch would get pushed in and out. Last week when it was in for it's oil change I asked them to take a look at it and they said they "made an adjustment" to it, but when I got home it was still doing it. It went back in on Wednesday (by then the squeak had gotten MUCH worse) and today they called and said new clutch parts had come in and the tech was in the middle of replacing it. Told me it should be done by monday.

Hopefully the new parts make the car a little more enjoyable to drive.

 

That's great!
I know you have been disappointed and glad that's behind you.

One of my favorite upgrades to my R56S for 30K miles was the Craven Speed Adjustable Short Shifter.

 

Glad they're taking care of it for you. The new clutch in mine makes all the difference in the world -- definitely breathed new life in it for me. Hopefully it does for you, too.

 

Do you know what the part numbers are on the new clutch that went into your car? I think my dealer put in the non JCW clutch, but I'm looking online at the part numbers and from what I can find it's showing the JCW clutch part numbers as the same as the part numbers for the S?

The clutch was determined to be "worn" and several parts were replaced under warranty. Here's what my paperwork says:

21-20-8-606-067 SET CLUTCH PA 2
23-11-7-568-467 CLUTCH REL.FO 0
23-11-7-545-084 PRESSURE PIN 1
83-22-0-416-601 TRANS FLUID M -9

Also I'm not sure what exactly is involved with getting into the transmission, but driving home from the dealer today I noticed a dead spot at the center of the steering that was definitely not there before. Driving in a straight line I can wiggle the wheel back and forth a few degrees and it does nothing, never experienced that in a MINI before. Going to check the pressures in the tires and crawl under the front and see if anything looks off, otherwise I'll have to call them and see what the SA says.

 

I had the same experience with the part #'s. They told me the JCW and the S have the same part #'s. I had mine replaced and I now avoid starting from the stop at the bottom of my hill of a driveway. Can't say whether it is better or not than the original clutch, but mine is a 2014...

 

Now that I'm looking closer I think Ed has a non-s, so it would make sense that they put the S/JCW clutch in his. I think the biggest improvement I've noticed is consistency. My old clutch had zero of it. The engagement point was rough, awkward, and unpredictable which meant I could never start off smooth or time my shifts, up or down. Now that it's a little more predictable it's MUCH easier to take off from a start (I'm definitely taking it easy from a stop and avoiding hills) and much easier to time my shifts. It's so much nicer to drive.

 

No, mine is a S All4. I don't know if the part numbers are the same or different or whatever, but it sure feels different. Like you said, it's 100 times more consistent and predictable than it was before. And now I DON'T have to avoid starting on hills. Like yours, it is absolutely much nicer to drive. I have to think it's a different part/parts -- I don't think they could have made that much of a change with just an adjustment or replacement with the same part(s). This clutch never felt this good, even when it was brand new.

 

Well I'm not sure what exactly was wrong, but when my car went in for it's scheduled oil change a few weeks ago they noticed transmission fluid leaking and it had worked it's way down most of the underside of the car. They cleaned it up and had me drive it a few hundred miles then I brought it back in to try and find where exactly it was coming from. After it spent ~5 days with them, they said it was leaking from the rear main seal and they had replaced the whole thing. Looking at the paperwork it's a new gearbox unit, and the old clutch (they replaced that back in January so it was still in good shape). I don't really notice much of a difference driving it, all I can think is it leaked enough fluid that it damaged the internals enough to need to replace the entire thing. All under warranty of course. I looked up the parts online...not a cheap repair. Sort of glad it's a lease, not sure I'd want to keep it beyond that.

 

Glad they found it and fixed it for you. But it sure doesn't instill a whole lot of confidence in the car.

 

I bought the NM Eng Torque Arm Insert a few weeks ago and finally had time to install it last night. Wow, what a freaking difference. I have a '13 JCW Paceman with the JB+ tuner and as all of you have experienced, the whole clutch, take-off, engagement thing was equally frustrating. Every day felt like I was learning to drive a stick again. Not to mention the acceleration from a dead stop, was less than desirable. This is a whole new car! it has much more torque in 1st gear, and just seems to engage a lot better.

I highly recommend putting this in. A huge difference. A little pain in the butt to get back in but, well worth the 15 min install.

 

Hmmm.... Very very interesting. This issue wit the clutch not being able to engage correctly from a dead stop is something I have noticed with my Paceman as well & I have had it only 5 days. I thought it was just me not being use to the clutch or something. For the life of me I have not been able to start off from a dead start without doing some kind of double slipping maneuver which now come naturally at every take off. Thank you so much for confirming that I am not the only one seeing this. I really am not looking forward to having to explain this to the dealer, and have them come back and deliver a verdict of "Functions as designed".

 

If you take it back to the dealer, tell them to stop on a hill and then take off from a dead stop. Anybody with an ounce of experience with a manual will see that it's not right. It took my dealer two tries -- the first time they said it was working fine. When they finally listened to me and stopped/started on a hill, they saw the problem and replaced the clutch.

What doesn't help at all is that they detune the timing when it's in first and I think second gear, not just on these but all models with manuals and many other makes that I've since heard about. Supposedly it's so you don't dump the clutch at high revs and tear the tranny to shreds. That's always annoyed the crap out of me and part of the reason why I'm now driving a slushomatic.

Anyway, good luck with yours.

 

Funny that you mention starting at the bottom of a hill. This is the exact scenario that I ran into several times this weekend. Car nearly stalls out as if I'm an amateur, forcing me to do some kind of double clutch gas reflex maneuver. It actually seems to be getting worse. I hope I don't have to fight with the dealer on this.

 

So I have to give a nod to the service team at my local Mini dealership. It took a little convincing, and we had to compare using a different mini and the hill test, but finally the service manager agreed to put in a new clutch. I have been in loaner since Friday. I think the clincher was letting the service manager try the hill test himself and it completely stalled every time.