Ok I have a question about the dynamic Traction Control. I have finally got to that point ready to get my new mini. I have been talking to my dealer for about 2 weeks now. He has located a car that is almost identical to my build but it doesn't have dynamic traction control.

I am just wanting to know what everyone thinks of the dynamic traction control vs not having it. So what is your opinion?

 

I don't have it on my MINI, but did on my old BMW. It's really not necessary, especially on a front wheel drive car. DSC should be more than sufficient.

 

From what I understand the option enables the electronic diff. I've run an on ramp with full on and full off and their is a bit of a difference when I approach the traction limits. When all the controls are enabled you can feel them intervening and its pretty annoying. And in some cars if you lower or change the suspension these systems can get screwy. That said it was a must have for me and I'm glad I got it. But the feature doesn't allow you to completely disable all the tactics controls so I'll have to make due with what I got.

 

DTC is a function that allows the yaw rate sensors to eliminate small amonuts of understeer in a panic situation and rotate the rear end around the front to get you through a turn. It's a good benifit for getting you out of trouble, but in the end a properly driven car won't activate it. So as you get better you won't even notice it.

 

I wouldn't let that be the deciding factor on whether to wait on your ordered MINI or have the dealer bring one in for you.

 

I don't have DTC, but from what I've read on the internets, you can fully disable it by holding the button down for 5-10 seconds to turn it off. Is this true?

 

Thanks so much for all of the input. I put my deposit down about an hour ago to get my new mini cooper s. I am excited. Photo to come soon.

 

Yes, if you hold it for 3-5 seconds it will light the center speedo DTC button but if you hold it longer it will show a caution sign on your Tach and it is fully disengaged.

 

This is true but it comes back on if you get out of shape. I tested this in the rain in full off mode and sure enough it came back on. I felt the brakes come on even though I was mashing the throttle. I'm crossing my fingers that it won't do this after I get suspension work done, I want some oversteer.

 

I advise reading the manual (online at ol.miniusa) or the description at www.miniusa.com.

Most of the statements in this thread are completely inaccurate.

 

Edited/deleted as I mis-spoke and mixed-up what my '07 had vs what my '12 has...sorry about that.

 

Thanks everyone for all of the great infomation. My mini should be here in couple of days.

 

Actually, go look at MINI's website. All MINI's come with DST. DTC is optional.

I wish I had EDLC!

 

I regret having EDLC. It activates too easily and kills acceleration out of corners. It can not be turned off.

 

christomapher: you are absolutely right. I had it all mixed up so I deleted my statement above. I went back and checked what my '07 had vs what my '12 has. Turns out, I mixed the two up. The '07 came standard with ASC (All Season Traction Control) with an option for DSC. The '12 comes standard with DSC with an option for DTC. The confusion came in that both had some form of traction control...I blame Mad Elf beer for that one .

I am disappointed to hear that one. That is why I ordered the DTC was to get the EDLC (or eLSD) as you can no longer get the mechanical LSD. Coopers doing autocross without LSD are at a real disadvantage to say the least. The manual implies that this should just be a brake application, it doesn't say that power should be killed as it does with DSC. Did you try it with DTC and DST turned off by holding the button down for at least 3 sec as the book says? On my '07 the ASC was the real power killer any time the tires spun and ASC is part of DSC (at least that is what my '07 book says). That could be killing your power if it is not turned off. The web page says that with DSC and DTC turned off only EDLC will activate to prevent the inside wheel from spinning under hard acceleration.

 

I'd rather have ELDC enhancing traction coming out of a turn rather than spinning wheels and less control.

 

That's the second time I've heard this said about EDLC. There was a video about a racing driver complaining it was killing the power. The complaint sounded like he was describing traction control (which kills the power), not what EDLC is supposed to do (brake one wheel).

I could use what EDLC is supposed to do in the Tristan (turn 11 at Infineon in particular), but if it kills the power that'd be annoying. Shawn has the mechanical LSD, I can still spin a wheel.

 

From everything I've read from MINI, EDLC only uses braking to slow the spinning wheel. That's exactly why I ordered mine with the option and, therefore, had to wait a few extra weeks for MINI to start actually building cars with that option back in '08.

 

The e-diff applies one brake. If you don't turn both DSC and DTC off at an autocross you will know it immediately. It cuts the power so severely and for so long that when I accidently left DSC on I didn't need to brake at any time during the run.

My experience would not necessarily translate to an S, a JCW, nor the street. I'd rather manage the wheel spin myself. Maximum traction under acceleration is gained with a small amount of spin.

 

That would be an interesting video to see. However, I will test it out soon and will know for sure. We are going to get snow soon and I am going to try it all out in a parking lot . I will try to get some video.

The web page also says that if the DSC is turned off, the DTC takes over. Then it says that "...it (DTC) also helps deliver a more spirited ride by allowing the vehicle to slide a bit before correcting your actions. It also reinstates power to the engine sooner than DSC, making your backroad sorties all the more engaging." Sounds like a "track mode" to me

 

Try this: http://btwyx.com/Movies/InfineonDec11B3Rev.mov

That was on the outlap, the first time with the DSC switched off. Up to then I'd been mashing the throttle and the traction control had been taking care of it, and I'd been annoyed by the traction control. I was surprised as to what happened and there was a definite smell of burnt rubber coming from the front.

 

So, no power kill then with just the EDLC? Seemed like you had good power.
Saw the iPhone...are you using a track ap?

 

No EDLC in Tristan, if we ever upgrade I'd add it on.

The iPhone ap is Harry's lap timer pro.

 

Well, I got an opportunity to try out DSC and DTC in the snow; both in some curves and straight. As a point of reference, my Mini has new snows on it (see sig.) My conclusion is that it works just as the Mini web site says (sorry no video). That is:

1) With the DSC and DTC on, fully, there is intervention when there is very slight wheel spin or sliding. Power is cut immediately. It was hard to tell what was happening in the curves, other than the light would flash when the DSC kicked in. This seems to be very well set up for snow conditions.

2) A press, slight pause and release of the DSC button clearly turns off the DSC and the word "traction" shows up at the bottom of the tach, indicating that DTC is now in charge. What a difference. In the snow, the intervention was very late for straight line acceleration. Front wheels would readily spin, but at a point the DTC would intervene and basically hold the wheel spin a certain level. In a corner, I am not sure at what point it would kick in as I was not comfortable with the speed I would have to go to kick it in. However, I was definately sliding. I would definately not use this for general driving in the snow. But it would be good for like rocking the car when stuck in snow. Now the really use for this setting will be on the track where you still want the dynamic stability control for a novice or intermidiate driver who may occasionally need a beneficial correction in a corner, but it won't kick in so much that it really kills the power.

3) Press and hold the DSC button until the message "DSC off" shows up with the warning triagle. There is absolutely no intervention; None. The only itervention that I got was was when the tach hit redline and the rev limiter kicked in. If you hit the gas too hard in a corner, both front wheels will spin and the car just goes sraight. Back off a little to let the front wheel get traction again and the EDLC pulls you right around, but there is no indication on the dash that EDLC is activated as there is when DSC and DTC intervenes. This is the setting for autocross.

IMHO - Mini has done a great job with DTC. The only problem that I seen now with it is for someone who is trying to understand what it does from reading the owners manual...that book doesn't help at all on this subject. There is better information on the Mini web page. As for its full abilities, I will know more when I get a chance to try it out in an autocross. I am looking forward to that now that I understand it better. Also, from my experience I would have to say that anyone who is experiencing engine cut-back during agressive driving doesn't really have the DSC AND DTC fully turned off. If it didn't kick in for me in the snow, it is not going to on dry pavement.

 

Did my first autocross and tried all three settings.

With the DSC/DTC fully on, there was way too much engine cut back. It was maybe good for the first run but only to force a slow run to get the lay of the course.

With the DSC off and DTC on ("traction") showing, there was still noticable cut back. It took a heavy foot to kick it in. Not as much cutback as with it all on, but still too much for autoX. This may be good setting for the track where the dynamic control will keep a novice out of trouble.

The best setting was with everything off. Power came on well, but the turbo lag was noticable a lower RPMs. The EDLC worked will. I was able to lay down power in corners without major wheel spin and the acceleration was noticably improved over my previous open diff Mini. Overall, this setting was good for about 1.2 sec on a 36 sec course. I have never driven a Mini with mechanical LSD, so I don't have a good comparison with that but it seem to work well. It would be fun to have an adjustable EDLC so more braking could be dialed in to the slipping wheel. IMO the system could do with more braking to be truely effective in autoX. I would say this system seems to be more set for track.