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Sorry to hear about your son. I hope he is OK, although this being the 3rd time, one begins to wonder.....
I, for one, see no reason to change the location of the pipes. I have an aftermarket Supersprint exhasut, and it has swept-up DTM style tips that stick out considerably farther than stock and I have not hit my legs in the year I have owned it.
The tow hook on the front bumper is another story.... I whacked it once with my shin, and guess what......it has not happened since. Go figure.
I read a definition of insanity once that went like this: Doing the same thing over and over, and expecting different results.
__________________ 2006 MCS-JCW No. 15543, BRG/W, Sport Pack, Chrono Pack, M7 SRP I love deadlines. I love the "whooshing" sound they make when they go by. - Doug Adams ambientpixel@mac.com
Could this be the newest trend combining the automobile culture with the body modification culture?
__________________ Disclaimer: No claim is made that the quality of the MINI-related advice offered by Yucca Patrol
is greater than the quality of MINI-related advice offered by other NAM members.
They could easily design a heat shield or something else that would make it safer, is all I'm saying. .
I don't understand what you are all complaining about. At least my manual clearly states ...
When driving, standing at idle, and parking the vehicle, take care to avoid contact between the hot exhaust system and flammable materials, e.g. hay, grass, leaves, etc. Such contact could lead to a fire resulting in serious personal injury and property damage.
Ya know, I had a stove do that once to me. hmmm, why isn't there a warning sequence that one has to go through every time someone turns on the burner? I don't see a design flaw in this, more like an issue of not paying attention to your sourroundings.
Be alert, the world needs more lerts.
moral of this story: some things by their very nature are designed to heat up. Don't be surprised when the laws of thermodynamics are applied to the unwary.
I second that!
__________________
09 CR\B JCW
Has to share with Kimini03
I read a definition of insanity once that went like this: Doing the same thing over and over, and expecting different results.
If you look closely at her post--she related it is the third time "someone" has been burned. I took that to mean it has happened to others--not just her son. If this has happened to the son 3x then I agree with your quote. A suggestion for him could be to take up playing the flute--no need to put it in the "trunk" it would be small enough to carry up front.
Bought 2005 MCS "BUD" 8/04. Sold 5/09.
Bought 2009 BMW 135i 6spd. "The Red Baron" 5/09. Sold 6/11.
Ordered 2011 JCW "BUDacious" 5/9. PW/Chili top and mirrors. Delivery 6/13.
1. Findude never said it happened to the same person more than once. I assumed it happened to three different people - hence the idea it might be a design issue.
2. When opening the boot, most people stand dead center to the car. Right where they put the handle. Right where the MCS has the exhaust. Since the back lifts up on the hardtop, I would imagine that someone would lean into the car (meaning get close) to unload. On most other cars, the exhaust is off to one side or the other. I can easily see where someone who is not expecting it get inadvertantly burned. We can't even say that the MINI is not "most other cars". The MC exhaust is on one side. Why couldn't the dual exhaust have been split to either side like a lot of others?
Yes, caution is always called for, but there have been three people who have gotten hurt on this particular car. It's just not right to make fun of Findude when s/he's being concerned for others.
__________________ Cricket: 2010 Pepperwhite JCW Convertible with 'tude.
findude/ImagoX- if the exhaust tips concern you, any muffler shop can set them further back, or cut them off and replace them with non-protruding tips.
Hope the boy heals quickly. If it makes him feel better, have him tell people he was attacked by a giant squid, but got away!
Again, it's not that this concerns me... I stated pretty clearly that on MY car, this will never be an issue, as my trunk opens down, tailgate-style.
What I'm saying is that, in my opinion, this placement is a bad decision, or at the least that anything that hot should be sheilded. Products are refined and enhanced all the time to incorporate a higher degree of safety and precision - remember that it wasn't too long ago that seat belts were completely optional, for example.
I'm sure that many people, when the debate over first making the INSTALLATION (not use, simply their inclusion) of seatbelts mandatoy in motor vehicles said many of the things I'm hearing above... "Well, if you plan to drive fast then you shoud tell your dealer to install a seat belt... me, I don't need them and neither do my kids because I have the common sense to not get in an accident," etc. We all remember back when a kid in a car seat was an oddity - now we cringe at even the THOUGHT of a kid unrestrained in a car. This is a Very Good Thing, in my opinion.
The world is an imperfect place, and accidents happen. I design products for a living, and I can tell you that good product design always strives to anticipate not only what PROBABLY will happen but what MIGHT happen as well, and strives to fix any potential issues before they occur while allowing the product to do its job in the most efficient way possible. This is doubly important when a simple accident or lapse in concentration may lead to physical injury, such as we see above.
So, OK, you disagree. You think it's silly to fix what you don't feel is broken. Luckily for all of us that SOME people DO think about this stuff, and you should be thanking them every time you strap on a seat belt, get restrained by an air bag or keep from driving off the road when your antilock brakes keep you from losing control on a rainy street because, hey, stuff should be as safe as possible.
__________________
~Matt Cook | Dublin, Ohio | '92 Classic Mini Sprite: "Fiona" + Purple Haze 2005 MCS Cabrio: "Dawn". See old MODs from "Nano" HERE - post #166 - many with How-to links!
They could easily design a heat shield or something else that would make it safer...
Safer for my Mini...
Naaaa....hang them waaaay out and make sure it's flat black...then stand back and watch the action Seriously, "don't touch the car" is what tell my kid and no ones' been hurt yet...
__________________ Famous last words..."I'm just going to change the wheels and tires...I promise"
It's... a hot exhaust pipe! Have we completely lost our minds? It isn't going to kill or maim us. It isn't going to launch us through a window and end our lives. If we flirt with it, we will burn ourselves a bit. And we will heal.
Nothing to remain but the psychological trauma
__________________
"You got a great car... Yeah what's wrong with it today?"
I actually wonder of that may be SAFER, since it's so visible... The stock tips LOOK like they are beneath the curve of the bumper, but obviously, they're not, hence the burns on multiple people.
Of course, mothing's more visible than a completely exposed motorcycle pipe, and I think EVERYONE that's ridden long enough has been burnt by one at least once...
__________________
~Matt Cook | Dublin, Ohio | '92 Classic Mini Sprite: "Fiona" + Purple Haze 2005 MCS Cabrio: "Dawn". See old MODs from "Nano" HERE - post #166 - many with How-to links!
Your line of reasoning makes no sense. Read your manual. It clearly warns you not to touch it.
If I follow your reasoning, what do you do with hot stove tops? Not cook?
What if you have a wood burning stove? Go ahead and touch the top of one of those things and see if you dont get burnt.
However ... the manual will CLEARLY tell you NOT to touch the hot oven. You do .... then duh.
Um.... this isn't the same thing as voluntarily touching it and it has nothing to do with what is or is not in the manual... The exhaust is mounted right beneath the handle, and obviously people are accidentally brushing up against it when they lean into the car. Good design = avoids accidents (or it should at least strive to avoid them). I'd personally say that if multiple people are all getting burned in the same way, then that's an issue that should be identified as a desirable fix, and it would surprise me if Mini's not already working on a solution.
But... whatever man. Really. :impatient
Eventually one of two things will happen... someone at Mini will say "hey, I hear that people are accidentally hitting that hot pipe despite the warning in the manual - we should fix that in the next iteration" (likely), or someone will do something weird like a lady in a skirt will lean into the trunk, get burned, will finch away and slip on the ice, bang their head, miscarry, then will sue Mini for $16 million dollars (unlikely - but weirder things have happened, believe me) and THEN it will get fixed via mandatory recall, driving up everyone's cost.
__________________
~Matt Cook | Dublin, Ohio | '92 Classic Mini Sprite: "Fiona" + Purple Haze 2005 MCS Cabrio: "Dawn". See old MODs from "Nano" HERE - post #166 - many with How-to links!
Your line of reasoning makes no sense. Read your manual. It clearly warns you not to touch it.
If I follow your reasoning, what do you do with hot stove tops? Not cook?
What if you have a wood burning stove? Go ahead and touch the top of one of those things and see if you dont get burnt.
However ... the manual will CLEARLY tell you NOT to touch the hot oven. You do .... then duh.
I don't understand your continued argument. Do you think people actually meant to touch the exhaust and get burned?
No.
Of course we know not to purposely touch a hot exhaust pipe. Of course we know not to purposely touch a hot stove. That's just common sense.
What the original message in this thread was trying to address was whether a modified design could prevent accidental contact. That's all. That's what I believe ImagoX is trying to get across.
There. Simple message since I don't thnk you're reading ImagoX's messages all the way through.
__________________ Cricket: 2010 Pepperwhite JCW Convertible with 'tude.
When driving, standing at idle, and parking the vehicle, take care to avoid contact between the hot exhaust system and flammable materials, e.g. hay, grass, leaves, etc. Such contact could lead to a fire resulting in serious personal injury and property damage.
Actually, the above quote from the manual doesn't warn you not to touch or put your body parts in contact with the hot exhaust system, it tells you not to place flammable materials in contact with the exhaust.
Seriously, it is all a tempest in a teapot. Sorry to hear your son and two others got burned on the exhaust tips. I never would have thought about the chance of coming in contact with the exhaust tips while reaching into the boot.
__________________ RIP (Horace): 2010 MCCSa HzB/B; His (Capt. Jack Aubrey): 2011 MCSa SO/B; Hers (on order) 2012 MCCSa BRG2/B
Sorry that anyone gets hurt! I, too, leaned against the tailpipes while reaching far inside the boot and, sure enough, have a crescent-branded left shin to prove that I associate with a MCS. (This was not a bad burn for me, however. It could have been worse--and I would have been much more upset if it had been my wife or a child.) I've been around cars all my life and I know that the tailpipes are hot, but I was surprised by getting into these. Definitely a new experience. (It also occurs to me that I haven't warned my wife about this--although she has yet to actually pry the MCS out of my hands long enough for her to experience much of anything about the car other than what it is like to motor in the first mate seat!) It would be good for you to provide feedback on this problem to MINI. Likewise for anyone else who has been really injured. For future versions, they might just take some step(s) to improve the situation, even if just to clearly warn unwary new owners.
Actually, the above quote from the manual doesn't warn you not to touch or put your body parts in contact with the hot exhaust system, it tells you not to place flammable materials in contact with the exhaust.
Seriously, it is all a tempest in a teapot. Sorry to hear your son and two others got burned on the exhaust tips. I never would have thought about the chance of coming in contact with the exhaust tips while reaching into the boot.
You mean skin is NOT a flammable material?
__________________ 2006 MCS-JCW No. 15543, BRG/W, Sport Pack, Chrono Pack, M7 SRP I love deadlines. I love the "whooshing" sound they make when they go by. - Doug Adams ambientpixel@mac.com
I can see it now. This will become the new form of tattoos. You could be the envy of the crowd. Sitting there in your shorts showing off your Borla, Milltek or whatever you have.
This is NOT a motorcycle and, for better or worse, constant safety upgrades to vehicles have left us with the expectation that we do not need to watch out for things like red-hot pipes sticking back from our cars.
Please don't tell me you'll be hitting people if you drive an 07, because MINI had to make the hood so a pedestrian is less likely to get hurt if you hit them. Saying a car is engineered to be safe so one need not pay attention is scary reasoning. I have airbags but I never plan to make use of them. BTW redlights don't stop cars.
Exhaust = hot
Fire = hot
Heat burns.
Don't touch hot things.
Be aware of what is around you.
I haven't seen a recall on the tops of grills (the cooking not automotive type) and they look the same hot or cold and are easy to lean against.
I've been burned by the tips and it will only happen once. The MINI had been off for 1/2 hour to an hour (enough time to cool the tip with past cars) I was cleaning it and decided I didn't like the deposits that were on the tips ssssss not happening again.
One thing you may want to try is take an allan wrench and remove the chrome tips, then the actual tips won't stick out as far (and I prefer the look of the black tips on my black MINI but thats another story)
Yucca I think they'll need to make the wings logo into the tips before the exhaust branding craze takes off.
I don't understand your continued argument. Do you think people actually meant to touch the exhaust and get burned?
No.
Of course we know not to purposely touch a hot exhaust pipe. Of course we know not to purposely touch a hot stove. That's just common sense.
What the original message in this thread was trying to address was whether a modified design could prevent accidental contact. That's all. That's what I believe ImagoX is trying to get across.
.
First, I dont think your assumption is true. The originator seemed shocked that his sons leg was burned. Wow ... 3 times its a safety issue ... this tells me they actually thought the exhaust would NOT be hot.
How can that be when the manual clearly states the exhuast is HOT???? I really do not think people read the manual. You have been warned ... clearly.
Can a modified design prevent contact? Maybe, maybe not. Do you really think the BMW engineers didn't think of this or just let it go??? Maybe they thought "Hey, how many ppl are going to burn their legs so we'll just forget about it?"
You really don't want any exhaust under the car where the fumes come come up into the cabin. There is a logical reason why tailpipes stick out ... so CO goes out the back and not knock you out while driving
Lets be a bit realistic here. READ your manual. Follow the directions and you won't get hurt. Since MINI clearly warned you of the consequences, trying to get them to do anything would be pointless since it would also then effect EVERY car maker ...
However, feel free to fight city hall. I can respect that.
I don't understand what you are all complaining about. At least my manual clearly states ...
When driving, standing at idle, and parking the vehicle, take care to avoid contact between the hot exhaust system and flammable materials, e.g. hay, grass, leaves, etc. Such contact could lead to a fire resulting in serious personal injury and property damage.
Does anyone read their manual?
How can it be more clear than that?????
Manuals? We don't need any Stink'n manuals.
Only Metrosexuals and Chicks read the stink'n manuals.
__________________
As Napoleon was deceiving the neighboring farmers he was also tricking his own animals. The scapegoat was again Snowball. "Whenever anything went wrong it became usual to attribute it to Snowball." In fact many of the claims begin to sound ridiculous to the objective mind. Of course, Squealer's mission is to keep everything subjective in the minds of the animals.
Guys, cut some slack here. It was his son who got the burn, so saying "you should know better" may not apply to a kid.
I think the you should know better attidue is directed toward those who think the car needs to be reengineered so they need not pay attention to the world around them.
I whacked it once with my shin, and guess what......it has not happened since. Go figure. 
Cricket: 2010 Pepperwhite JCW Convertible with 'tude.
Seriously, "don't touch the car" is what tell my kid and no ones' been hurt yet...
RIP (Horace): 2010 MCCSa HzB/B; His (Capt. Jack Aubrey): 2011 MCSa SO/B; Hers (on order) 2012 MCCSa BRG2/B
Lets not forget the gays, the clowns, and the people who keep asking whether an MCS requires premium gas
