I recevied a contract yesterday. By phone I was told that the box required 40amps amd 240 volts and edison does not allow an electrical monthly price break for 240 volts.

Also, Manhattan Beach is getting a fleet for 10 per car per month. What's up with that?

 

Hi Greg...with the contract should have come another attachment from Edison. While it doesn't mention rates it mentions the Mini E. I called them up and was quoted a rate of .17 per kwh in the winter and .18 per kwh in the summer. This rate is only good if you charge between 9pm and 12 noon seven days a week. I've seen articles that talk about California's special .07 or .08 per kwh rate but those must be in other areas and not in the Southern California Edison market. This rate is only for the car and you must have a separate meter installed, in my case a piggy back type meter, to get this rate. We're typically in the tier 5 range of our Edison bill so this rate is roughly half of that. A light user might be in a lower tier range and the savings wouldn't be as great.

 

Just had a call from Kristine...install happening tomorrow (Friday) at 8am. Will take pictures and get them posted pronto.

 

I think the reason for the misquoted rates is the way the rate tariffs are written. The EV rate is .0612 off peak for power generation, but there are other charges that drive the rate up another .1045, making the total close to .17:

http://www.sce.com/NR/sc3/tm2/pdf/ce114-12.pdf

Finally got my installation contract (no charge- whew!) and sent it in. They didn't send the Edison rate application so I will call them and ask- I notice it is a step that is called out in CFCI's flowchart.

- Scott

 

Well, THAT was a short ride.

To recap my situation, since it's smeared on a few different threads - CFCI wanted an extra $1,500 because my panel is on the opposite side of my 2-storey house from my garage, and they would have to run up through the attic. This really doesn't upgrade my service in any way (ie. already have good 200A service) - it would just supply me with a 220V 40A line in the garage, which to me has dubious future use beyond the Mini E test program. So I can't justify that amount on top of the exorbitant lease.

I spoke to CFCI who was very responsive and dropped the cost to $1,100 - better but still too high for me. I proposed a cost-sharing arrangement with Mini - they shot me down.

So I'm out. I want to wish everyone the best of luck in the coming year. I will probably stay on as a lurker as I'm truly interested to see how all this will pan out.

 

Scott, let us know what you find out about the Edison application as one was not included in my contract either.

And Steve, sorry to hear you won't be continuing, but $1100 would have been above my limit too.

 

Since folks are mentioning they didn't receive the Edison sheet, I've attached it to this post (hopefully). I'm in Long Beach, CA.

 

Great news Jethro! Its cool to have the box installed. Now all we need is the car! I havent been called about the cable or final inspection. The wait just becomes more agonizing with the box just idiling in my garage!

I didnt call SCE about the special rates and meter. If my box is already installed, am I too late? And what is the potential savings with the cheaper rates?(and what exactly is the EV1 rate?)

fiesty

 

Steve, that's a bummer. Who would have thought the layout of your house would be such a factor? At least you know what it might take if you wanted an EV in the future.

Thanks for the form Jethro. I am on the East Coast this week so I still haven't connected with CFCI, that might not happen until Monday at this rate.

Fiesty, you can look at the link I posted earlier to see the exact rates. On the SCE site you can look for the residential rate 'tariff book' (or on your bill) to see what the regular tiered rates are. For me the savings were maybe .10 to .15 per kwh, remembering that a full charge is 35 kwh.

 

Just got my contract from Clean Fuel Connection minutes ago. My cost of the install will be $952. So if I factor in:
1) The bad economy and an unknown income flow;
2) Two cities' politicians getting nearly free cars, while making us MINI enthusiasts (the ones who who can truly appreciate and enjoy the car) foot the bill;
3) An out of pocket expense of $952.

...then I'm out too.

I wonder if BMW realizes that they may be losing business because of potential padding by their electrical subcontractors?

 

Thanks, GoDucks. In trying to justify the extra $1,100, one thing I considered was that maybe it would be useful for a future more permanent e-car. But there were just to many ifs - IF a real-world practical e-car makes it to market, IF we're still living in this house then, and - the big one - IF a 40A circuit will be compatible with future battery-charging technology (remember those now-useless charging stations at Costco?). Just didn't add up for me.

Oh well, I was going to get a Mini this year anyway, now I'll have to be content with a Convertible Cooper S . . . .half the cost, I don't have to give it up in a year, unlimited range, a back seat, a real trunk, better performance and handling, a color-scheme and options I get to pick out myself, and a carbon footprint that's still better than 80-90% of the vehicles out there, and depending on which studies you read and where your electricity comes from, could produce as much CO2 as the Mini E. On paper, there's absolutely no contest . . . .so why doesn't it FEEL that way?

 

Sorry to hear that Edgein - but what can I say - obviously I agree with you.

Maybe if enough of us drop due to the added cost, Mini will have to rethink it's policy on this. We'll see.

 

Thanks GoDucks, I went to the SCE website and looked at the EV rates pdf. I called SCE and arranged for the seperate meter, as there is no cost for the meter/install, just a daily meter charge. Being a seperate meter, it will also be seperate on your bill, so you can see exactly what the MINI E is costly you per month to charge. I recommend everyone who has SCE to get this seperate meter, as its beneficial, even if the cost savings is neglible.

fiesty

 

My thought process was the same if the electrical upgrades were not included. I am a bit sad at the amount of money CFC is charging some of the people here, really really disappointed.
Actually I was about to order a JCW in January, when Crevier notified me that I was selected for the E. It was just ridiculous timing, a week later, and I wouldnt have been part of this field trial.

On a seperate note, I am going to argue with Crevier that I shouldnt have to pay the increase sales and vehicle reg taxes that just went into effect in CA, because of BMW's inability to get these cars out when they promised. Lets see how that goes.

fiesty

 

It's good to hear that you were able to have the seperate meter installed after the charger was installed. Do you know if this is the preferred order of installation? Or does it matter one way or the other?
Thanks.

Edit - Nevermind, I see from Jethro's post below how this is done!

 

Just had the charger, extra circuit box aka subpanel and timer installed today by SunPower Electric. Paul and Andy did the install. Took four hours. See link below for photos. I took some before and after pictures. The Charger is a 40 amp system which they mentioned is the only one Mini is currently using.

Here is a link to the pictures:

http://toddandkari.smugmug.com/galle...25071114_yEVYY

Also, an important note that I wasn't exactly clear on. The only way to get the special EV rate from Edison is to go the route that I did. It doesn't matter if you have a 400 amp panel with plenty of room available. Unless you have the Time of Use Meter (second meter) installed you won't get that rate. I'll be billed $500.00 for my portion of today's install.

Next step is for Edison to come out and install the special piggy back meter. Then SunPower will come back up to hook up the cable between the meter and the box. See picture #9 in gallery above. They'll also be bringing the actual cable that runs from the charger to the car.

Attached is a PDF with pictures of the various ways to install the meter. Our meter will be coming off the left side like the first three pictures.

Once meter is installed I'll add more pictures to our gallery above and post again.

 

SCE definitely wants to see you are getting the car before they will put in the seperate meter. I think if they see the charging station installed, that should be enough for them to install the meter. Although, I did hear the customer rep say they may want to see the car before the install the meter. At this point I am a bit confused how the meter situation will pan out, but will know in a few days.

fiesty

 

In reference to my posting above with the pictures. The box outside with the cable sticking out of the top contains two 40amp circuit breakers. The box on the inside to the left of the Charger is a timer, just like the kind you have for your sprinklers, etc.

 

won't CFCI connect the mine e box to the new meter? SCE says that the install of the meter is free w/ a small monthly charge.

 

Hi Greg....for Edison customers, the Mini E charger doesn't connect directly to the new meter. It connects to the little gray box aka small sub panel in my pictures. The installation of that gray box along with the timer makes the second meter possible which then allows you to get the special EV rate. If one didn't care about the discounted rate and had a panel that could handle the extra load, then the charger would connect directly to your current panel on an open circuit.

 

Just out of curiosity...

What is the savings expected to be from the lower electric rate compared to the initial cost of installing the extra panel, meter and timer?

-Stu
http://www.stuartistry.com/my-mini-e

 

I had my inspection on Friday here in NJ. Since my garage is out (too expensive to upgrade), I looked and found 2 neighbors willing to help me out (2-car garage and 1-car families). Both seemed OK to the inspecting electrician, though some wiring from the panel would be needed. We'll see what the charges will be... people seem to be getting surprises... even though I thought MINI was covering minor work like running a line from an existing panel to a garage. Maybe the event in LA this week for participants will answer a bunch of questions for us all?

 

If I were you I would try to sort it out with the electricity guy directly. If you ask Mini (BMW) they will find a reason why you're out. Simply think about the insurance- the car is insured against theft, fire etc based on a policy BMW will provide. If you now put the car into a neighbor's garage, the insurer may say that it was not stored according to the policy as that's not your address. So I would not ask the question if you don't want to hear the answer.
But let's see how it plays out.
BTW, have you heard of any others in NJ? I am in NY (Westchester) and no one has approached me yet and I have also not heard of anyone who has.

Best
Klaus

 

Klaus,

I had checked with my MA in advance, and basically he says MINI is ok with a rental garage... but we'll see.

 

Edison installed the second meter housing today. My main meter was replaced with the piggy back version. Not sure why but the actual meter wasn't part of today's visit. Another visit from Edison is required to put the actual meter inside the housing. Once that is done, Sunpower Electric will return to hook up the cable to the meter. Getting closer.