Buying a new camera...recommend?

[Agro]

Hi. I'm an ok photographer but not great. I'm planning on upgrading from my Fuji S3800 3mp 6x optical zoom camera before AMVIV.
My requirements are:
Big zoom, at least 6x, more would be better.
Image stabilization to actually use the big zoom.
6 or 7 mp resolution.
Traditional look-through viewfinder (can be LCD)
Simple enough that my wife can use it as a point and shoot.
Enough features that I can learn with it.
Around a $300 price point

Nice to have:
Runs on AAs instead of a proprietary battery pack
10x or better zoom

The cameras I'm looking at are:
Canon Powershot S3 IS
Olympus SP-510UZ
Sony Cybershot H2
Panasonic DMC-FZ7

At the moment, I'm seriously leaning towards the Canon. The Olympus is nice, but no image stabilization. The Panasonic is the smallest physically, and its IS is great but the battery pack doesn't thrill me and it feels a little cheaper. The Sony feels unbalanced in my hand but has a 12x zoom.

Any thoughts/recommendations?

[GBMINI]

Agro,
I have the Canon Powershot S3 IS. I've just bought a new $$$$ Nikon D200. The Canon is quite nice but there were times when I wanted more (and could afford it).

I'll be very happy to mail the Canon out to you to try for a while - at least till after AMVIV if you wish. Email me if you want ...

[Agro]

Wow! That's a very generous offer Ian.
I've messed around with it a little in the store and I like the feel.
The biggest problem with a real dSLR is that my wife will refuse to use it. I have a good film SLR that I almost never use because a point-n-shoot digicam is so much more convenient.
Um...would you be willing to sell the Canon?

[Jray]

I've recently been wrestling with deciding on a new camera as well. After researching it to death over the past month... I finally ordered the Fuji F30.

But for you I would highly recommend the Canon A710IS. It meets all your requirements almost exactly. 6x zoom - check. AA batteries - check. IS - check. P&S for casual use - check. 7MP resolution - check. Features to learn with - check (can be used almost fully manual). Around $300 - how about $273? It has gotten good reviews as well. A couple people I work with recently bought it and they love it. If I was going to spend more money I would have jumped on it also.

[Agro]

Hmmm...I hadn't really looked at the "cigarette packet" shaped cameras. Most intriguing.

[Greatbear]

I have a Canon S3-IS. I highly recommend it. Super wide range zoom lens, great picture quality, capable video features, special effects and a wide range of manual and semi manual modes to get creative with. It has the feel of an SLR, uses standard AA cells and a folding/swivel LCD. Can be found for less than $350.

[Agro]

Do you ever use the swivel LCD? It looks cool, but when would it get used?

[Greatbear]

The swivel LCD is a wonderful thing!

It comes in handy when taking shots overhead (e.g. shots of a parade when you are stuck behind a crowd) or lower than your normal perspective (too many snapshots of kids get taken at an adult's eye level, giving the pictures a 'looked down on' perspective). The LCD can swivel 180 degrees making it visible from the lens end of the camera, great for taking self-timer shots when the photographer wants to be in the frame. If you like taking close-up nature shots such as macros of plants, flowers, critters, etc it's easier to use the swivelling LCD as a viewfinder rather than laying on the ground staring at a fixed LCD or viewfinder. I find taking some shots at chest to waist level instead of eye level gives a different perspective on common shots like group photos or sports shots. It's also a bit less obvious that you are taking pictures when you are holding the camera in cupped hands at waist level than having it at your face, so people tend to act more naturally and less posed (or shy).

The LCD viewfinder is what I principally miss when using my 30D SLR.

[GBMINI]

Originally Posted by Agro

Wow! That's a very generous offer Ian ... would you be willing to sell the Canon?

Yes, not really sure what a fair price would be though.

[DrPhilGandini]

The Canon S3 is fantastic. My daughter has one, after an S2. The swivel LCD is one of the great features of Canon P&S cameras.
And I would actually encourage you to consider the battery pack cameras, since they are generally *considerably* more powerful (mAh is the measure of stored energy) than AA batteries, very reliable and were originally based on video camera batteries. I have never had a digital camera that used AA batteries--and have never had any problems with proprietary battery packs. My wife's Olympus digital uses AAs and I am very popular at CostCo where I buy value packs of AA batteries every week for my wife's camera...

[GBMINI]

Use lithium ion batteries - they last for ever! And they don't suffer so badly in cold weather (though that won't be an issue for you Agro will it!)

[Agro]

My current Fuji uses AAs, and I have several sets of NiMH batteries. On a fresh set of 2000mah AAs, I can shoot over 200 pics, using the zoom, some using the flash.
Yeah, no cold here in Vegas. Or not. This winter was the worst since I've been in Vegas (6 years). 10 nights in a row with lows in the 20s, snow twice... I moved here from Nebraska and lived in Detroit so I know what a REAL winter is, but I moved here to get away from that kind of crap!
And thanks to everyone for the recommendations. GBMINI is sending me his S3 to try out, and if I like it, I'll send him money and keep it. Ian, you're a gentleman and a scholar.

[Greatbear]

Originally Posted by Agro

Ian, you're a gentleman and a scholar.

That was never in doubt around these parts.

[reelsmith.]

After living with my Olympus C3000 for about 6 years I finally upgraded to a Canon S3 IS and I absolutely love it. I like the way it fits my hands and I really like that a know-nothing like me can simply stick it in auto mode and take great shots. My MINI is not here yet, so I don't have any car shots to share ...but I took these cool shots of my wristwatches with the Canon. I simply put it in auto mode and set it to macro. Not too shabby for point-and-shoot.

http://www.chronosmith.com/images/Alain/Canon.jpg

http://www.chronosmith.com/images/PAM/Wet.jpg

Using it with a set of Sunpack Ni-MH rechargeables I have taken over 250 shots and the low-battery light has not come on yet.

I spent altogether too much time researching the purchase and most of the negative comments I read about the camera came from pros that were nitpicking. Admittedly, I know nothing about photography ...but I have to wonder just how much more can be expected for $350?

By the way, I was considering the exact same cameras you are, plus the Canon A640.

Best of luck.

dean.

[chrisneal]

Agro, for what it's worth, I'll vouch for the durability of the Panasonic cameras. Over the past 2+ years, I've lugged an FZ-20 (5MP ancestor of the FZ-7) on all kinds of backpacking trips, into extreme cold, high humidity, dust, rain, dank abandoned buildings, etc., and it hasn't protested a bit. Panasonics are not runway queens by any stretch of the imagination, but I have found it to be a very solid and dependable camera, and the Leica lens with 12x zoom has produced some gorgeous photos for me. I was happy with what I got for $500 in 2004; the FZ-7 seems like a killer deal for low 300s.

Have you read the reviews and comparisons on dpreview.com? They likely offer direct comparisons between some of the models you're considering.

[YELLOWMINIAZ]

I have to say I absolutely love this camera. It comes with charging batteries and they last forever. It sits in my purse for days and I still can use it. I bought it at Costco and I must tell you all to buy all your electronics there. They guarantee them for as long as you own them. I bought the camera before this model, the 8.1 and it broke and they took it back. I wanted to exchange for the same thing but they didnt carry it anymore and they had this one. Its an awesome camera...


Here are the specs....

10.1-megapixel CCD captures enough detail for photo-quality 18 x 24-inch prints
3x Anti Shake optical zoom; large 2.8-inch wide-format LCD monitor
Zoom Continuous Shutter mode allows the user to compare a wide-angle and a telephoto shot in same display and take both simultaneously
High-sensitivity shooting mode, up to a maximum of ISO 3200
Stores images on SD memory cards; powered by one lithium ion battery (included)


When you buy it at Costco... it comes with a SD card and carry case. Hope this helps.

[DrPhilGandini]

Originally Posted by YELLOWMINIAZ

...
Here are the specs....
...
High-sensitivity shooting mode, up to a maximum of ISO 3200
...

Be careful of cameras that claim this! Read Phil Askey's rants on dpreview (he's the site owner) and you'll understand why. Simply put, these cameras do *not* have high sensitivity sensors, but simply increase the noise to signal ratio to achieve pseudo-sensitivity. You'll get the crappiest looking image at ISO 3200 from a sensor that at best might have good ISO 200 sensitivity...

[Agro]

I looked at dpreview.com, but I do most of my initial research at www.steves-digicams.com. He has detailed (6-10 pages) reviews of several hundred digital cameras.

[Dr Obnxs]

it's a bit bigger than the others, but I just went through what you did, and my wife has one of the smaller zoom point and shoots. So my choice was smaller still and give up zoom for the package, or a bit bigger with lots of features. The G7 does almost everything that a higher end dSLR does, but it's still usable as a point and shoot. I found it for $388 on the web, well down from the higher prices that I saw elsewhere. CNet is how I found the vendor.

I'm very happy with it, but for me, the only downside is that it's a bit big for a shirt pocket....

Matt

ps, on image resolution, I got pissed because all the camera manufacturers are in pixel races with tiny CCDs. What this means is that you eat memory for bits of noise, not picture! Untill the CCDs get larger, the huge pixel numbers are a disservice to the camera. the G7 is 10.0 megapixels. I wish is were 7 or a bit less....

[Agro]

The S3 IS is 6mp rather than 10. I wasn't aware that the CCDs weren't keeng up with the pixel counts. I have a shot from my 3mp Fuji blown up to the width of a single garage door and can't see any pixelation. I think a good 6mp camera is going to keep me happy for quite a while.

Ian Cull is sending me his used S3 on spec. If it's what I want, and what I thought it would be, I'll be getting a very gently used one for a great price.

I knew posting in here was a good idea.

[Dr Obnxs]

before the G7, my favorite of all time was an early Kodak camera. Don't remember the model, but even though the pixel cound was under 3, it had huge glass and made great blow ups!It was stollen of my porch a while ago... Boo hoo! I haven't found a combination of features and image quality like it since.....

Matt

[GBMINI]

You should see the digi camera we have at work ... one of the very early Sonys, it writes to a floppy disk! Most of our PCs don't have readers for that media any more
I think it's a 1MB (didn't classify it like that back then) but it is great for super-close-ups of circuitry which is why we still sometimes use it.

[chrisneal]

Originally Posted by Greatbear

The swivel LCD is a wonderful thing!

...It's also a bit less obvious that you are taking pictures when you are holding the camera in cupped hands at waist level than having it at your face, so people tend to act more naturally and less posed (or shy).

Note to self: check for camera lens protruding from trenchcoat next time I see greatbear.

[Dr Obnxs]

Originally Posted by chrisneal

Note to self: check for camera lens protruding from trenchcoat next time I see greatbear.

I didn't think it was a lens!

Matt

[Greatbear]

Extreme telephoto with image stabilization, baby!