A basic guide to Spark Plugs.
#76
03-20-2013, 09:04 PM
#77
04-09-2013, 12:40 PM
Howdy,
I wanted to comment briefly on some advice that's being thrown around in these spark plug threads. As a disclaimer, this is not directed at any one member, nor is it an attempt at initiating a "pissing contest". I know this isn't an introduction thread, but I've been lurking here for literally a few years, but just recently bought a MINI. Before that, I built, modified and tuned maybe 8 or so forced induction cars over the past 14 years, primarily SR20DET applications, but some rotary, some V8, Subaru, FSDE, etc.
Bear with me here, as I'm going to focus primarily on modified engines. It seems that most folks here are running about 50% more boost over stock, have exhaust systems, as well as an intake of sorts. Fun stuff. If you happen to be stock or mostly stock (IE just a catback, or just an intake) feel free to ignore all of this. We're talking more to everyone that have increased their boost:
1) Plug material: You should be running a Copper plug. They're more conductive and have larger electrodes, which lends itself to a stronger spark. If you can do all these power mods, you can make time to change plugs every 10k miles. The benefit is very real.
2) Heat ranges: There is no set "if you run X amount of boost, you should run a colder or hotter plug. While this does play a significant role, you really need to consider your driving style, or more accurately, what type of driving style your environment permits. If you have all these modifications but rarely if ever get to open up the throttle, there's a chance that you'll be fouling spark plugs if using a colder range. Because they run cooler, there's a higher likelihood of carbon build-up, thus reducing spark power and efficiency.
3) Factory gaps: You should always check them. Always. In the 14 or so years I've been playing around with cars, I've experienced multiple instances where gaps on new plugs were out-of-spec. A feeler gauge is maybe $5. Use it.
4) Gapping: I've seen a lot of people here saying "open up your gap if you're running more boost". That's wrong, and actually the opposite of what should happen. There's a direct relationship between spark plug gap to tip temperature and the voltage required to effectively ignite the Air/Fuel mixture. By increasing the gap, you're increasing the need for higher voltage to maintain the same quality of spark, for lack of better terms. You're inviting spark blow-out, spark quenching, and misfiring. If you have an aftermarket ignition, OK, great. By all means maintain OEM gap or open it a bit. Otherwise, you should be closing the gap for increased boost applications.
So let's put all the hypotheticals together: If you're running increased boost (more air moving faster), let's say...an off-the-shelf tune or maybe bigger injectors (fuel enrichment making the the mixture denser and gas laden), a colder plug of a less conductive metal (dissipates heat more effectively but can increase carbon build-up and reduced efficiency), AND you're running a bigger gap (requires higher voltage and more likely to experience combustion quenching or blow-out). It's really not a super recipe...at all.
I wanted to comment briefly on some advice that's being thrown around in these spark plug threads. As a disclaimer, this is not directed at any one member, nor is it an attempt at initiating a "pissing contest". I know this isn't an introduction thread, but I've been lurking here for literally a few years, but just recently bought a MINI. Before that, I built, modified and tuned maybe 8 or so forced induction cars over the past 14 years, primarily SR20DET applications, but some rotary, some V8, Subaru, FSDE, etc.
Bear with me here, as I'm going to focus primarily on modified engines. It seems that most folks here are running about 50% more boost over stock, have exhaust systems, as well as an intake of sorts. Fun stuff. If you happen to be stock or mostly stock (IE just a catback, or just an intake) feel free to ignore all of this. We're talking more to everyone that have increased their boost:
1) Plug material: You should be running a Copper plug. They're more conductive and have larger electrodes, which lends itself to a stronger spark. If you can do all these power mods, you can make time to change plugs every 10k miles. The benefit is very real.
2) Heat ranges: There is no set "if you run X amount of boost, you should run a colder or hotter plug. While this does play a significant role, you really need to consider your driving style, or more accurately, what type of driving style your environment permits. If you have all these modifications but rarely if ever get to open up the throttle, there's a chance that you'll be fouling spark plugs if using a colder range. Because they run cooler, there's a higher likelihood of carbon build-up, thus reducing spark power and efficiency.
3) Factory gaps: You should always check them. Always. In the 14 or so years I've been playing around with cars, I've experienced multiple instances where gaps on new plugs were out-of-spec. A feeler gauge is maybe $5. Use it.
4) Gapping: I've seen a lot of people here saying "open up your gap if you're running more boost". That's wrong, and actually the opposite of what should happen. There's a direct relationship between spark plug gap to tip temperature and the voltage required to effectively ignite the Air/Fuel mixture. By increasing the gap, you're increasing the need for higher voltage to maintain the same quality of spark, for lack of better terms. You're inviting spark blow-out, spark quenching, and misfiring. If you have an aftermarket ignition, OK, great. By all means maintain OEM gap or open it a bit. Otherwise, you should be closing the gap for increased boost applications.
So let's put all the hypotheticals together: If you're running increased boost (more air moving faster), let's say...an off-the-shelf tune or maybe bigger injectors (fuel enrichment making the the mixture denser and gas laden), a colder plug of a less conductive metal (dissipates heat more effectively but can increase carbon build-up and reduced efficiency), AND you're running a bigger gap (requires higher voltage and more likely to experience combustion quenching or blow-out). It's really not a super recipe...at all.
Last edited by TheBigChill; 04-09-2013 at 12:52 PM. Reason: Added small intro :0)
#78
05-25-2013, 02:32 PM
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#79
05-26-2013, 01:24 AM
#80
06-02-2013, 09:45 PM
i have an 04 R53 and every time i do an online search for some plugs (BKR6EQUP) i get platinum tips, can i not install iridium? I just want the right plugs. Help.
ONLY HORSEPOWER GAIN i have is a K&N typhoon CAI which plugs are best for me?
Daily driver, may race a honda once in a while at a red light
ONLY HORSEPOWER GAIN i have is a K&N typhoon CAI which plugs are best for me?
Daily driver, may race a honda once in a while at a red light
#81
06-02-2013, 09:47 PM
4th Gear
I must disagree with not using anti seize on spark plug threads, you have obviously never done a tune up on any Ford Modular v8 3 or 4 valve or even some 2v heads. Not using anti seize causes the jackets around the porcelain to seize up in the threads of the aluminum heads and they break in half when attempting to remove. Now a head job is in line. I am an ASE certified technician and do tune ups on all America's vehicles daily and have also owned MANY forced induction cars and built many and I would HIGHLY suggest using it. Dont use it in heavy amounts just a brisk dot will work and only every other tune up I would suggest, or dont and go ahead and crack those plugs loose after first tune up 20-60k miles later and see if they dont screech, pull threads, and so forth.
Not bashing you, just I have a lot of experience with spark plug removal issues in the Ford world which also have aluminum heads, and require head jobs frequently because the plugs arent anti-seized. This is AFTER a MANDATORY 24hr cool down period before pulling.
On the other note, does anyone have a gap spec for 02 MCS if going to use a simple single ground strap BKR6E or 7E? I dont see the necessity nor believe in running platinum or iridium plugs in forced induction cars? NGK BKR6E and BKR7E are dirt cheap (1.49-1.89 a piece) and SUPER abundant! Highly popular plug in the Japanese import world when talking forced induction, and I can replace them 3-5 times for the same price as 1 tune up with iridiums.
Not bashing you, just I have a lot of experience with spark plug removal issues in the Ford world which also have aluminum heads, and require head jobs frequently because the plugs arent anti-seized. This is AFTER a MANDATORY 24hr cool down period before pulling.
On the other note, does anyone have a gap spec for 02 MCS if going to use a simple single ground strap BKR6E or 7E? I dont see the necessity nor believe in running platinum or iridium plugs in forced induction cars? NGK BKR6E and BKR7E are dirt cheap (1.49-1.89 a piece) and SUPER abundant! Highly popular plug in the Japanese import world when talking forced induction, and I can replace them 3-5 times for the same price as 1 tune up with iridiums.
#82
06-09-2013, 11:35 AM
Newbie
I'm a newbie and not use to your web site. I just signed up to check if anyone is going to Mini Meets West in Bend Or. It starts June 17th and ends the 21st. I live in Eastern WA and I'm driving my 74 Mini to Bend on the 17th. If anyone else is driving from Eastern WA It would be nice to all hookup and drive down together. You never know what will happen with these old Mini's. I could meet somewhere along 84. Let me know if you can do this ASAP.
Thanks
Sorry I interrupted your post for this subject, but I didn't know how to contact other Mini owners in WA, any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Sorry I interrupted your post for this subject, but I didn't know how to contact other Mini owners in WA, any help would be greatly appreciated.
#83
07-18-2013, 07:03 PM
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#84
07-18-2013, 07:20 PM
#85
07-19-2013, 11:14 AM
FYI - the NGK BKR6EQUP and BKR7EQUP are no longer Iridium tipped. They are now "Laser Platinum" If sticking with an Iridium tip is a necessity you'll need to move to the BKR6EIX and BKR7EIX plugs.
#86
07-19-2013, 05:11 PM
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#88
08-31-2013, 10:02 AM
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FYI, the parts atraain mentioned/listed are all for 1st gen MINIs and you have an 07 R56 MCS, a 2nd Gen.
Just sayin'
Now these would fit, your MINI
, don't know about you budget though! 
http://new.minimania.com/part/G2NME3...6-57-COOPER--S
Just sayin'
Now these would fit, your MINI
, don't know about you budget though! http://new.minimania.com/part/G2NME3...6-57-COOPER--S
Last edited by john171; 08-31-2013 at 10:16 AM.
#89
09-01-2013, 05:28 AM
briggswill
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#91
09-09-2013, 09:54 AM
I read the article. Interesting. I didn't know that. Thanks. However, the article states "Metal shell plating acts as a “lubricant” which breaks away from the main body of the spark plug during removal." That seems to say that after removal, the metal shell plating, and thus the anti-seize properties, are gone. What do you do if you want to take your plugs out to check them before their life is up? Buy new plugs everytime? Diagnosing engine issues by looking at the plugs is not an uncommon practice. I guess you could use one set of plugs for diagnosis, since they won't be in the heads long enough to worry about seizing and, once you're finished with the diagnosis, install a new set of plugs.
Personally, I use anti-seize on all my plugs and I don't worry about it since I don't use a torque wrench to install my plugs. I know, heresy, but I've been changing plugs in all my cars and my family's cars, from air-cooled VWs to Chevy V-8s, for over 40 years, and except for the instance about 40 years ago that started me using a lubricant when I change plugs (that's another story ), I've never had any problems at all with my plugs.
I do recommend the use of a "thread-chaser" such as this http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/web...14924|L2*15043 to clean the threads in the head before installing your plugs though. I usually put a little bit of anti-seize in the grooves to catch the carbon that it cleans out of the threads and lubricate the threads at the same time, but you can also use grease if you want to avoid anti-seize, or just avoid lubricant altogether and let the little bits of carbon fall down into the cylinder. They're too small to hurt anything
Personally, I use anti-seize on all my plugs and I don't worry about it since I don't use a torque wrench to install my plugs. I know, heresy, but I've been changing plugs in all my cars and my family's cars, from air-cooled VWs to Chevy V-8s, for over 40 years, and except for the instance about 40 years ago that started me using a lubricant when I change plugs (that's another story
), I've never had any problems at all with my plugs.I do recommend the use of a "thread-chaser" such as this http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/web...14924|L2*15043 to clean the threads in the head before installing your plugs though. I usually put a little bit of anti-seize in the grooves to catch the carbon that it cleans out of the threads and lubricate the threads at the same time, but you can also use grease if you want to avoid anti-seize, or just avoid lubricant altogether and let the little bits of carbon fall down into the cylinder. They're too small to hurt anything
#92
09-09-2013, 05:32 PM
Absolutely. The article only applies to initial plug installation. You are correct sir. It was helpful as I was installing new plugs. I agree the use of anti-seize would be appropriate for subsequent removal for diagnosis. Thanks for completing the thought and clarifying for future researchers. Well done.
briggswill
briggswill
#93
10-06-2013, 09:53 PM
#94
10-07-2013, 01:29 AM
[QUOTE=czar;3098202]Ok guys, I see the same questions asked over and over about spark plug selection and fitment, so I hope this information below helps.
you then need to place a flat Copper washer of a specific thickness of your choice directly onto the spark plug shoulder, then screw the sealing gasket back onto the spark plug, once you then install and correctly torque down your spark plug you will get an indication as to the general direction of the ground electrode in relation to your inlet valve/s, you may need to do this many times using + or - to your first installed washer thickness to get the ground electrode in the correct orientation to the inlet valve/s
Hi i try to inmagine but i jus dont seem to get it...are you saying i should wrap a flat piece or maybe a sheet of copper around the plugs thread and screw it??? i am sorry if im wrong...
you then need to place a flat Copper washer of a specific thickness of your choice directly onto the spark plug shoulder, then screw the sealing gasket back onto the spark plug, once you then install and correctly torque down your spark plug you will get an indication as to the general direction of the ground electrode in relation to your inlet valve/s, you may need to do this many times using + or - to your first installed washer thickness to get the ground electrode in the correct orientation to the inlet valve/s
Hi i try to inmagine but i jus dont seem to get it...are you saying i should wrap a flat piece or maybe a sheet of copper around the plugs thread and screw it??? i am sorry if im wrong...
#95
10-07-2013, 05:43 AM
I would look at other things before assuming that spark plugs are causing a hard-start scenario. It never hurts to add new plugs, but misfire + hard-start indicates fuel delivery issues to me.
#96
10-07-2013, 05:48 AM
[QUOTE=cavalera;3821549]
He's trying to tell you how to "index" your plugs. Plenty of info on indexing on the internet, but, it's really a time consuming process with very little gain or benefit. http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/techinf...n.asp#indexing
Ok guys, I see the same questions asked over and over about spark plug selection and fitment, so I hope this information below helps.
you then need to place a flat Copper washer of a specific thickness of your choice directly onto the spark plug shoulder, then screw the sealing gasket back onto the spark plug, once you then install and correctly torque down your spark plug you will get an indication as to the general direction of the ground electrode in relation to your inlet valve/s, you may need to do this many times using + or - to your first installed washer thickness to get the ground electrode in the correct orientation to the inlet valve/s
Hi i try to inmagine but i jus dont seem to get it...are you saying i should wrap a flat piece or maybe a sheet of copper around the plugs thread and screw it??? i am sorry if im wrong...
you then need to place a flat Copper washer of a specific thickness of your choice directly onto the spark plug shoulder, then screw the sealing gasket back onto the spark plug, once you then install and correctly torque down your spark plug you will get an indication as to the general direction of the ground electrode in relation to your inlet valve/s, you may need to do this many times using + or - to your first installed washer thickness to get the ground electrode in the correct orientation to the inlet valve/s
Hi i try to inmagine but i jus dont seem to get it...are you saying i should wrap a flat piece or maybe a sheet of copper around the plugs thread and screw it??? i am sorry if im wrong...
He's trying to tell you how to "index" your plugs. Plenty of info on indexing on the internet, but, it's really a time consuming process with very little gain or benefit. http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/techinf...n.asp#indexing
#97
10-07-2013, 07:55 AM
Seems to only hard start the 1st time, great with any subsequent starts. Changing the plugs is my 1st try, hopefully it fixes it but if it doesn't ill check other things. Thanks!
#98
10-07-2013, 08:03 PM
I replaced the spark plugs with the Vpower copper. The car starts a lot faster and better but I do hear considerably more popping on the muffler. (backfires?) and lo and behold, the service engine light came on.
I did not gap the plugs as I assumed they were already gapped to spec. I uncovered the cyl 3 spark plug wire and noticed some rust so I cleaned it up. . .
I haven't had a chance to check codes again. May go back to my old stockers :(
I did not gap the plugs as I assumed they were already gapped to spec. I uncovered the cyl 3 spark plug wire and noticed some rust so I cleaned it up. . .
I haven't had a chance to check codes again. May go back to my old stockers :(
#99
10-08-2013, 11:36 AM
6th Gear
I replaced the spark plugs with the Vpower copper. The car starts a lot faster and better but I do hear considerably more popping on the muffler. (backfires?) and lo and behold, the service engine light came on.
I did not gap the plugs as I assumed they were already gapped to spec. I uncovered the cyl 3 spark plug wire and noticed some rust so I cleaned it up. . .
I haven't had a chance to check codes again. May go back to my old stockers :(
I did not gap the plugs as I assumed they were already gapped to spec. I uncovered the cyl 3 spark plug wire and noticed some rust so I cleaned it up. . .
I haven't had a chance to check codes again. May go back to my old stockers :(
#100
10-08-2013, 12:41 PM
If you had issues before the plugs, and then after the plugs....needless to say, plugs aren't your issue. Pull them, gap them, use them.
With that said, next time you buy plugs, gap them first. Never depend on factory gapping, ever. As JJF said above, give coil terminal cleaning a shot, and you can also see if wires are bad by swapping them around to different cylinders. If the misfire follows your move, you may have a bad wire. Unlikely but possible.
With that said, next time you buy plugs, gap them first. Never depend on factory gapping, ever. As JJF said above, give coil terminal cleaning a shot, and you can also see if wires are bad by swapping them around to different cylinders. If the misfire follows your move, you may have a bad wire. Unlikely but possible.