They would allow essentially identical clearance to stock injectors, though you'd have to simply move each adapter to the side a bit. Ohhh well.

 

So.................in the Mynes Video it can be heard " The OEM at·om·ize much etter than the others"

Now i thinking i should keep the 380 JCWs and go for more fuel rail pressure

 

The stock injectors I sent in came out of my coop at 68.000 miles.
The JCW injectors have about 45.000 miles one them but a much harder set of miles!

 

Well, they're comparing the two OEM Siemens units to 1) A crappy EV6, single beam, pencil spray injector (the 440), and a much larger 550cc which that particular injector is made to flow at a higher pressure. It's funny that they said that, because they are the ones selling the exact 550's in that video.

Atomization is always very important, but is most important during idle and very very light throttle driving. This is because there is very little air entering the intake manifold at idle, and with little air flow, you need the smallest fuel droplets as possible to let them be easily and evenly carried into the cylinder for combustion. Once you're driving, you have a bunch of air entering the manifold, assisting much more with the movement of fuel droplets; the fuel droplets can be larger without issue at this point. Is it ideal ? No, but remember, atomization also occurs when the fuel is sprayed at 50-60psi at the back of intake valves 2 inches away.

 

Couldn't find the original post on raising rail pressure but I did want to point out that other significant things happen when you do this:

Spray angle changes and the change will vary by injector brand. There is what we call an L/D ratio (length over distance) between the valve and the metering disk. It's different for every brand and the only way to predict results is to measure at operating conditions. It could be benign, but there are even consequences looking at metering disk holes cut by laser or wire EDM (we use both but are moving to laser cut holes).

We also measure SMOV, standard minimum opening voltage. The standard Mini injector were about 5V and the JCW's were about 5.5V. This voltage required to open the injectors only comes into play when you are starting your car, say, in the winter in Minnesota with a 5 year old battery. As you increase rail pressure and flow, there is usually an increase in SMOV. Once you get into the 8 - 9 volt range, it can really be an issue. People don't often realize that their 12V system has all kinds of variation and most of the parts on it are optimized and measured for 14V. You're basically starting out 2V behind and going down hill from there.

 

Good info. I was just going to comment on the limitations of increasing fuel pressure to alter flow rates. Ultimately, it's a bit of a band-aid in my mind.

 

I would add we are starting to see injectors characterized at 4 bar. Usually on the returnless rail applications where pressure varies.

DI, OTOH, is a whole other ball game. Pressures are higher even than diesel and we'll need all new equipment everywhere in order to even begin looking at producing.

 

I'm staying away from DI like the plague, until manufacturers smarten-up and assess & mitigate the inherent carbon build-up issues. Subaru got it right with the BRZ / FRS; Port and D.I. in those babies. Bravo.

Getting 3 more MPG's isn't really worth it when you need your head cleaned multiple times over the vehicle's life span. No offense to those here who own R56 and newer.

Here's a shot of an R56's intake valves w/ 60k on the motor:

 

Guess I should be more detailed, I was thinking of a Return style Fuel system, with a regulator so i could bump up psi 1 or 2 pounds on track days, ( my car is getting so far from being a street car anyways )
I try and keep fuel level low during evets added fuel between sessions.
I also wanted to a do a dry ice a cryo fuel cooler. I do have a intercooler sprayer on the car I used last year with my stock intercooler, Curious to see how it works with the Gp intercooler, I have a switch in the car I turn on, it puts power to a relay hooked to a boost activated switch,
I use it once the tires are hot and trying for fastest laps,
Most the events I run they only count your 3 fastest runs
Next Mod ive been thinking of is replacing my roof, Getting rid of all that glass!!

 

k im still a bit confused, but if i were to order these gensis 380's from lets say here http://www.034motorsport.com/fuel-in...r-p-17934.html they will be direct fit (with the exception of raising the IC a bit) and i wont need adapters for the plugs?

 

Greek if you get those

Those will be direct replacement

But that's if you get the ones pictured ( which I'm sure you will )

I wish I had gotten those but the slight modification I did was worth the savings I got

 

You only need to raise the intercooler if you need to use an adapter on the injectors, otherwise, they'll be plug & play.

As Vietnameeh said, if you get the ones pictured on the site, you won't have to modify anything.

 

ok cool thanks a lot guys.

 

Why would we buy those possibly questionable Genesis 380's from 034moto... for $70 when the OP linked to what is apparently OE 380s for only $6 more? It doesn't seem like the ~$30 is worth the trouble assuming the Rockauto (Standard Motor) units are actually OE.

c

 

well they are not actually OE, and could have a qustionable manufacture, the genesis it seems like everyone and there mother uses for their car(not just mini's) and have not had problems.

 

Now that you have a data point for the (used) JCW injector, it would be nice to see how it compares to the FJ968 Standard/Delphi unit.

 

There's nothing questionable about them. They're built with new, genuine Bosch parts, and not drilled. They're also the recommended injector by multiple well known VAG tuning companies.

 

Chuckt what's questionable I'm running them in my car now with no ill effects?

 

Fitment is my only real question. So if your IC clears them and they don't need adapters for the wiring all will be good.

As far as I can remember, no one in this thread has actually tried them yet.

 

I know those are easy fixes, but if the others are an exact physical match with the same spray pattern, I'd rather use them for now. If SM comes out with a copy next year and we can get them for a significantly better price, I'll be all over it.

 

... Ok we'll I tested them and they work fine... There's a whole page of me confirming they worked in this thread

The ones pictured on the 034 look the same as the helix injectors(which are probably the same)

 

well ill probably pick the genesis inj. up soon after i get my car back together and make sure its running ok.... then ill place my order, then make an appointment to get a JCW tune. thats all i want and that's all i will ever need for a very, very long time.

 

Greekdrifter same path as me lol

 

034 is selling Genesis 380's. Helix simply re-sells Genesis 380's under their own name at a $100 markup, but they're without question the same injector. Over the years, there have been about 3 iterations of Genesis 380's. All are usable for our cars, using the correct spray pattern for a small, multi-port head, though, some needed harness adapters and some did not. That's why if you look them up on the interwebz, you'll find a few different looking injectors. USRT was using whatever the best and most applicable parts at that time were, to make the Genesis 380's.

I'm going to be running Bosch part# 0280158096 next week. These are a EV14 factory injector used on many multi-port heads, including several 2005-2012 Volvo T5's, 2005-2009 Euro Spec Ford Focus ST T5, 2007-2009 Ford Mondeo T5, etc. Now that we've run JCW and base R53 units and found their dynamic and static flow rates, as well as spray pattern, I've spent days and days searching literally thousands of injector specs to find suitable replacements (impedance, static & dynamic flow, spray patten & angle, body size, etc. Bosch 0280158096 is one of 3 suitable replacements for JCW 380's.

Also, for anyone who cares, Mynes, RMW, and a few others are selling Bosch 550's for a huge markup. These are Bosch part# 0280158117, and are 510cc at 3 bar fuel pressure, and 550cc at 3.5 bar. These injectors are nothing more than the stock injectors used on 2007-2012 Ford Mustang GT500. They can be had new for $47.00 each.

If people are interested in the other two JCW 380 alternatives, let me know and I'll furnish details. For now I'm keeping to myself in order to avoid long-winded explanations (not that I don't love it )

 

i vote for more alternatives!