Right on. As a tenured Bosch development engineer, you can tell us with some level of certainty, which injectors work for our application. I'm an Electromechanical Engineering Tech in GE Global R&D's combustion lab. Not automotive injector specific experience, but applicable nonetheless. I've linked us all to a Bosch generated Excel file in my previous post. Let's get to work

I'm not questioning whether or not major and reputable aftermarket injector providers know this info, or whether OE customers are privy, of course they are; my question is why it is not readily available when public customers are selecting injectors for their application. I also think we should be giving more of our attention to the dynamic range of an injector, which will best suit the application in question. As you know, this is the injector’s ability to deliver high flow when required without compromising precise metering during idle and low-flow conditions, yes ?

Helpful links:
http://performancefuelsystems.com/In...TechCorner.htm
http://www.rceng.com/technical.aspx

 

I have to admit that, although I am currently designing fuel injectors, coils, and fuel rail assemblies, I am primarily concerned with the mechanical assembly rather than the system level parameters. About 20 feet away from me though, is the guy who developed the Lucas disk injector and further down the isle, the guy who developed the existing Standard Auto G injector. My time at Bosch was primarily O2 sensors but I did have some FI involvement in the EV14 parts.

I'll be happy to provide whatever information I can but my initial suggestion would be a higher flow injector with a similar spray pattern and offset. I can run it by the other engineers tomorrow.

 

No worries, you're a good resource regardless. Having a contact within the industry is great.

 

You the Man!

 

Purchased the genesis injectors only $200

Went on a hunt and found that a lot of vw/Audi guys sell them cheap to get bigger injectors

 

Yep. VWVortex will have a bunch of Genesis 380cc and stock Audi TT (225hp version) units. All are 380cc and have the specs we need.

 

I guess we'll find out if these work soon!

 

question for you guys,

what are some things i should look for before swapping these injectors out... .

the more and more i compare pics of the genesis injectors and the stock oem injector... the more i keep doubting myself.... they look different...

should I compare body size when i have the stock one out to make sure... they fit well... things like that

the genesis injectors I bought are attached...

when you guys mention body size are you guys talking about the measurement from the actual body minus the nozzle?...

actually the more i look at the injectors.... did i receive the wrong injectors? these look like the 550cc injector from genesis

http://www.usrallyteam.com/index.php...roducts_id=100

 

If they are 380cc then swapping them will have little to no effect on the normal running of the system, if you are going to do the work yourself (and its pretty easy) I would just swap them and see if the car starts and runs ok.

If it does then great you got a nice inexpensive set of 380cc injectors, if they are 550cc then its not going to run right as the computer does not know how to handle the pulse for that large an injector and will require a tune.

But a quick look at the injectors looks like they will fit the fuel rail just fine, it does look like there is a plug adapter but that's is no big deal.

 

ya injector swap part looks easy... i had the intercooler off couple days ago to do the OCC and looked straight forward....

but now ... im hoping i can get a refund if these are really 550cc alot of conflicting pictures.... i see white bodied, black bodied... guys on vwvortex selling the same injectors as 380cc... weird

 

Genesis offered multiple iterations of the 380cc (white, then black). With that said though, I've never seen a set of Genesis 380cc that have the body shape / orientation yours have. BUT, Bosch, who is likely the true manufacturer of these, changes body styles after a while, EV14 being the newest(and what you're picturing). The only Genesis 380cc units that came with the EV6 connector(what you have there, and NOT what we need) was the 380s with the white body.

Also notice that yours have a connector adapter in order to mate with our EV1 connectors, which is fine, but not what USRT.com, ecodetuning.com, etc, advertise for 380cc.

I would take a few minutes, and call USRT for identifying marks so you can find out for sure.


EDIT: On closer inspection, there are some differences between your picture, and the picture of 550's on USRT.com. The 550's on USRT look to have A) a longer body length, and B) on the injectors you pictured, just above the chrome nozzle area, there is large protruding disc shape that is absent on the Genesis 550's at USRT.com. You may have just received the newest injector body style for Genesis 380cc's. I still say call USRT, as they're super knowledgeable when it comes to injectors, especially "Genesis".

 

He's telling me that i am going to have to trust him on this there are no identifying marks whether they are the usrt genesis injectors, but he can assure they are 380cc ( I seem to trust him since he's long time vwvortex member)

With that said will these even work? Do I need to do something with the connectors... I'm also going to contact usrt since they are on vwvortex

 

I think you're fine. But still, contact USRT; they'll tell you for sure. Regarding additional work to make them fit, no, the units you bought already have the US-Car-to-Jetronic (EV1) connector adapter on them.


Oh, hello: http://www.ebay.com/itm/4-380cc-BOSCH-Fuel-Injectors-BMW-Mini-Cooper-S-02-08-/121166758605?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1c361a02cd&vxp=mtr
Look familiar ? As I said in other posts, the linked injectors above are unmodified Bosch units, and OEM equipment for 2005-2011 Volvo S40 & V50 Turbo 5 cylinders. Bosch #0280158096

 

Ouch then I overpaid

 

Haha. As soon as they were posted here, someone bought them; I'm assuming a member of NAM. Enjoy.

 

whoever got them can you please come back and report whether they DO infact work...

I plan on doing the same... so we can compile some type of aftermarket list that do work

so we can all help each other save some $$$ and make some power

 

some interesting info, not really set in stone but from my seller he was willing to give me a refund, but I am going to confirm with USRT

but the injectors i purchased were actually purchased from a authorized dealer that sells USRT genesis injectors....

reply back I got was that

With Genesis, you get what they send you. Pictures are not a great thing to compare as it all depends on what they choose to make them from as there are several sources that they draw parts from.

They are indeed Genesis 380 cc injectors.

 

I'm getting off-track a bit, but, next up:

The 550cc injectors that Mynes Performance offers, is Bosch part# 0280158117.
As stated by Mynes, and as you'll see, these need the USCAR to Jetronic connector adapter.

Bosch #0280158117:


Mynes 550cc:
http://www.motorlogs.com/modification/3944/881/3973

 

Just got word from Scott at USRT the injectors I got are indeed 380cc and they have different variations of 380cc

Bigchill your observation of the black ring that is on the 550cc and not on mine is correct
380cc do not have that black ring

 

So put them in lets hear how it goes.

 

Will try to get them in this weekend

 

Great. I look forward to your results, though, I'm confident all will be well.

I'll eventually compile a list of injectors, both "aftermarket" (like Genesis) and OEM injectors from other cars, that meet all of our R53 requirements for a safe alternative to JCW and pricey aftermarket units. As of right now, I only have two uncertainties in my way.

1) I need to know the range of body sizes that we can use, without having to utilize spacers and additional hardware for fitment. I know the Genesis units will fit, as it's what Helix was selling as "plug & play". I'm confident about others as well, though, I want to know for sure.

2) We call JCW units 380cc; we call base R53 units 330cc. I need to know if these stated flow rates are at 3 bar, or at 3.5 bar. I understand that the R53 runs 3.5 bar fuel pressure, BUT, it's much more common for injectors to be referred to and named by their flow rate at 3 bar in this industry. Clearing this up is paramount to selecting more suitable alternative injectors. I'm fairly confident that even though we run 3.5 bar fuel pressure, that the 330's and 380's are flowing those rates at 3bar, not 3.5bar, which actually makes things easier for me. If anyone can prove one way or another, please chime in.

 

Folks, just to remind you....
not only does it fit, and run, but how does it TUNE.
A injector that saves you $150 to buy, that costs you an extra 30 minutes of dyno time to tune might not be a great deal....
In all honesty the 380 is pretty limiting HP wise....you can get to 200-210, maybe 220 depending on how aggressive the tuner is, but the BIGGEST plus of the JCW380's is they are a KNOWN item...the MAPS that make them run VERY nicely are already perfected...so a canned tune for therm should be pretty good...as noted many times, the flow characteristics of different injector designs varies...and that affects lots of things.....
An unknown injector MIGHT need some tweaking to get it just right...
If you are self tuning with the Byteronic system, guess it does not matter...
But if you want a canned tune or a JCW tune...it might not be ideal...heck with JCW's, a custom tune is even pretty fast!
That having been said, LOTS of great info here!!
Kinda wish this info was around 4 years ago....
somebody has to be first!
Good Luck guys, and keep up the GREAT work!!

 

Its my understanding that both the R53 MCS and JCW run the same bar settings. I know when I switched my 330cc's out of my 2005 R53 MCS for the 2006 R53 JCW's the pressure regulator was the same part number.

Btw.. there are adjustable fuel pressure regulators available for the R53 fuel rail. But what about running something at a higher bar without a return line? What would be a safe bet? I think I might have found a couple 4.0 and 5.0 bar regulators that might work. I need to further look into them but Im curious if they would work ok with just the factory or even after market 380cc's and maybe even give more acceptable performance after a tune?

 

i will be getting a canned a week after putting these injectors on.... wanna drive with injectors for a week first... to just make sure everything works ok.... then going to have way make me a quick tune.... will see how it works