Happy holidays everyone.

We have recently acquired a new White 2006 Land Rover LR3. The vehicle looked immaculate after the initial dealer detailing. Not a single flaw. (Well, cosmetically. What can I say? Its a Land Rover.)

I have washed it 3 times I think since it was delivered. As I was washing it today. I noticed scratches. Quite a few of them. There were swirls and some fine ones, I guess just from washing it.

What in the world did I do wrong? I thought I was doing everything exactly right. Heres what my normal routine is:

1. Wash all wheels with wheel cleaner and wheel wells with dawn. (I like good looking wheel wells.)

2. Rinse entire car with water to remove larger dirt particles. The car isn't that dirty, I just do it to remove the dust.

3. One section at a time, wash with car shampoo. I use Meguiar's Gold Class shampoo and a MF sponge.

4. I then dry the car with a chamois. Its fairly new, so its not covered with dirt or anything.

Where did I go wrong? What is the best way to remove and prevent this from happening with minimal effort? The MINI is not quite this bad, but I think its just because it has metallic paint and I can't notice it.

Thanks in advance, and have a happy Holiday.

Here's a quick pic:

 

your bucket and wash mitt, your technique as octaneguy calls it?


do you use grit guard in your bucket? do you rinse your wash mitt
after each app of car shampoo?

 

Swirls just sorta happen. They can be from the MF (depending on the quality of it), from the chamois, from maybe not getting the mitt/sponge completely clean before putting it back on the car (which is why some people use two buckets - one to wash and one to rinse the mitt/sponge in) or even just from having a dusty car and then driving it around. The teeniest particles can cause swirls.

If they're very very minor you can use a paint cleaner/swirl filler product like Prima Amigo to hide them until you can get time/resources to get them polished out. I just did this on my pillars because they came from the dealer looking god-awful, all swirled up...a little Amigo and they now look better than new.

 

I don't have a gritt guard, but I think I'll start using 2 buckets. I didn't really think about that. Also, my sponge isn't very high quality. Its a target brand. What should I get?

 

You might not be responsible for the scratches at all. I've seen dealers and car wash places that will leave swirls, but the wax or sealant they use has fillers that will mask the swirls, at least until the car's been washed a few times. Then the fillers wear away and the swirls re-appear.

 

Land Rover ... a REAL 4 x 4. Really nice!

Swirls? Dunno, ask Agranger or Brad

 

Bingo. thats my betfor the sudden change, I mad ethe mistake of letting the dealer wash Pearl the first few weeks I was left with a buch of tiny swirls. You can't notice it most of the time as I add wax every week in the warm months, the synthetic and the canuba mangage to fill in any and all gaps. But when I'm fresh off the claybar until I have the first 3 or so coats of wax on I can see every single hairline scratch.

Also YOU CAN NEVER USE TOO MUCH WATER it is a major barrier between your mitt and scratches when shampooing. I try and wash out all of the dirt from the mit BEFORE ever putting it back into the shampoo. And always save the wheels for last they have the most grime all you do is track it with you round the rest of the car and it will scratchin there is any on the mitt.

When you clean the panels how does your hand move? the goal is to get the dirt off the panel as fast as possible so none of that circle motion stuff should be all lines folowing the panel to get the dirt off of the panel ASAP and washing the dirt off the mitt between strokes.

 

Well, I'm 100% sure it isn't the dealers fault. I just went out there to finish drying it. Its just painful to look at such a young car look so old. Ok that didn't really make sense.

When I wash it, I use the short MF side of the sponge...as in not the side with the long MF strands. I just a front back motion with as little contact as possible. I go over a section once, maybe twice if its really dirty.

I'm thinking it might be the chamois....but I dunno....

 

I have heard multiple sources say that a sopnge is just about as bad as steel wool it traps all the dirt then each pass with it sratches the finish

 

Wow...really? What do most people use?

 

A previous poster was probably correct. Dealers wheel the car in detailing and apply products that hide everything. Then you wash the product off and yikes, imperfections. The goal of the dealer is to make the vehicle look new any way they can.

You need to use a high quality wash mitt for washing.

 

I use a lambswool mitt and the two-bucket wash method.

 

How can you be so certain? Did you see the car between when they started detailing it and when they put on the final wax/sealant? The detailing personnel at most dealerships are unmotivated buffer-monkeys that don't worry about what they do to your car, as long as the final wax/sealant hides it.

 

im using the Griots MF wash mitt, but they also have wash pads that they
released only months after i bought the mitt... im going to get the pads
next time. i know a lot of people use sheepskins too.

http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?&SKU=10268

http://www.griotsgarage.com/search.j...htext=wash+pad

http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?&SKU=10222

 

i've been using a sheepskin wash mitt (not unlike the Griot's one, which is probably very good), but I got mine at wal-mart (even though i hate the company) -- see pics attached. i've heard that as long as it says 100% sheepskin, you should be good.

i use the two bucket method with grit guards in both.

also, I take the mitt, put it in the soap, run it over a section of the car, only in one direction (front to back usually, or back to front on the bonnet) and then flip it over, run it over another section, then rinse it out, rubbing it over the grit guard and sometimes hitting it with the hose to wash it off.

last, when I dry, i use a waffle weave drying towel from Detailer's Paradise. I never wipe the towel over the surface. I just lay it on the panels and let it soak up the water. this takes time and a few towels (although using the hose to "sheet" water off first helps), but i don't like moving these towels around on paint, except maybe the bumpers and inside the door frame. The onlly towel I'll move across my paint is the Monster Fluffy.

still, with all of this, i can see some slight swirls on my bonnet (ugh - so i feel your pain) and definitely on those pillars. could be from the dealer or could be from me, i don't know, but i try to be careful.

incidentally, my car had a lot of rain dirt on it yesterday and since I only go over panels one time with the mitt (and again, in one direction, never in circular motion) I did have to go back over a few sections with the mitt. even then, later, when i was drying, I had to use some Slick quick detailer and a Moster Fluffy on a few dirty spots I missed.

 

Yes I did. I drove it off the lot a few days after it got off the truck. It was a friday night so they picked it up a few days later to detail it.

 

Thanks for the links. I've never bought detailing supplies of the internet before because they're readily available right down the street! Now that I know there is a quality difference, I'll make sure to get the best. I think I'm going with a sheepskin mitt. Since my experience with the MF, it can never be my friend again. (lol just kidding.) I'll look around and try to find some high quality MF blankets for drying. I like the chamois, but have a feeling thats contributing to the scratches. :impatient

 

I think I'll go with your method. As you may have read in my last reply to kenchan's post, I'm going a different direction. I switching to a sheepskin mitt and drying with MF blankets.

 

it all comes in play, meaning the soap you use, the amount of soap
you use, the mitt you use, the wash bucket you use, the amount of
water you use, the towels you dry with, the amount of pressure you
apply on the wash mitt, the towels, etc.

i use the MF wash mitts (will change to pads later on), griots car wash
and bucket (been using the Meg GoldClass the last couple of months),
and dry using the combination of Griots paint blade, Griots MF thick
drying towels, leafblower and finish off with SprayOn wax at the end.

i looked a my black Legacy's finish in the dark pointing a bright light
at it (not super bright) there is barely any swirls in the paint that is
detectable. last time it was polished was back in August.
and this is with a one bucket system.

 

My 2 cents worth is to get the waffle weave for drying. It makes it so you don't have to rub the car. Also , I think some people cheap out on the soap, you want it to be as slippery as possible. Go by the manufacturers directions. I also prefer the lambswool mit.

 

slippery soap is good soap.

 

can anyone comment on Prima Mystique? I've been using Meguia'rs NXT Car Wash, which is fine, but i'm not sure i've got the amount correct... i tend to use 4 capfuls in a bucket (don't know the size of the bucket, but the grit guard fits in it). it is slippery, but not overly. Am planning on buying Mystique, but this NXT is lasting forever.

 

Mystique is more concentrated that NXT Car Wash or Meguiar's Gold Class. The latter are mixed with 1oz per gallon. Mystique is about 0.5oz per gallon. It's extremely important that you put the proper ratio of soap to water to ensure proper lubricity between your wash mitt and your paint. Too much soap and you may get a residue that stays on the car after you rinse it off. Too little soap and you could be scratching your paint without realizing it.

The GritGuard will fit in a 5 gallon bucket--it might fit in a 3 gallon as well. If it's lasting forever, you might not be using enough. That product comes in a 64OZ bottle. If you're using a 5 gallon bucket, then you should be using 5 OZ everytime you wash. That should give you 12, almost 13 washes.

Richard

 

I've been using the Prima Mystique for a few months. I like it. You will tend to want to put more than is needed in at first since it is so concentrated. Actually I think the bottle says to use 1 oz per 5 gallons of water, so of course, being a male, I double it. It is still less than others though.
You will also have to accept the fact that it does not bubble and foam like other soaps. Just deal with it though because it is really slick and it also seems to help the shine on the Epic. Also, and this is really cool, it changes colour in the bottle depending on how much sunlight it is exposed to. It starts out as a kind of purple and then the more sun it sees the greener it gets. That's some funky stuff (alien technology I believe).

 

The label reads "Mix 1 - 2 ounces with 5 gallons of water." Since I'm used to using the recommended 1oz per gallon with the Meguiar's car soap, which ends up being about 4.5oz per 4.5 gallons of water in a 5 gallon bucket (I don't fill the 5 gallon bucket all the way) for Mystique that translates to about up to 2oz per 4.5 gallons of water.

Remembering 1-2oz with 5 gallons can be confusing if using less than 5 gallons, so half or a little less than half of the measuring cup I use is appropriate. Works for me!