Differences between products in Prima line

[mitch171]

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I am getting ready to order prima for the first time. After reading on the DP site I am confused about selecting some of the following:

Hydro vs. Slick as a QD. Do I need both?

Slick vs. Clarity as window cleaner?

Epic vs. Banana Gloss. Both are waxes right? Is the main difference that BG is much faster, but Epic is... well epic?

Also I have a 2005 CR/W cooper, due to an accident before I bought the car (nothing major just cosmetic) the bonnet has been repainted, due to a ding and stupid parking lot the passenger side has been repainted, due to fender bender (my fault :( again only cosmetic) the front bumper has been replaced and the roof refinished because the license plate flung up and damaged it. When I bought the car there was a problem with the rear bumper the dealer had this fixed and refinished.

The point of all that is to decided what level of polish I would need, afaik the driver side and the boot are the only areas that haven't been repainted since it was new in 2005. I am assuming the most aggressive polish I would need is Finish, or do you think just Amigo would do the trick?


So as of now I am thinking I will need
Mystic, Finish, Amigo, Epic, Hydro, Nourish, Clarity

I may not be able to afford to do this all at once (graduate college student) so what is priority, probably: mystic, Epic, Hydro?

Thanks in advance.

[bee1000n]

Hydro vs. Slick as a QD. Do I need both?
Hydro is wax, Slick is QD. Put Hydro on your wet car after a wash and it'll protect for about 2 weeks.

Slick vs. Clarity as window cleaner?
Clarity for cleaning. I suppose you could clean windows with Slick, but I haven't tried it.

Epic vs. Banana Gloss. Both are waxes right? Is the main difference that BG is much faster, but Epic is... well epic?
Epic is a full synthetic wax that lasts 4 to 6 months, Banana Gloss lasts 4 to 6 weeks. BG has natural carnauba wax in it, so it makes darker colors look deeper. You can get the best of both worlds by putting BG on top of Epic.

I am assuming the most aggressive polish I would need is Finish, or do you think just Amigo would do the trick?
If you have swirls in your paint, you'll need Swirl to get them out (using a dual-action polisher). You can try Finish first, but in my experience Finish doesn't do much for swirl removing. It's usually used after a more aggressive polish to remove hazing. On a CR car, you might be some benefit of using Amigo prior to Epic. If you have the time and inclination, go for it.

What is priority, probably: Mystic, Epic, Hydro?
Yes! Wash it frequently, put a good coat of Epic on it for lasting protection and then boost it with Hydro after each wash. Your car will be happy.

[MeliaAndSam]

I personally do not like Slick on my windows, but some do.

remember that a 'good' coat of epic does not mean a thick coat. use as little as possible. this is hard when you're only half way through and you want to be done already!

[mitch171]

Thank you both for your response.

I am a little confused as to what the difference between a QD and a wax is I guess. I assumed a QD was a light wax, I have never used a QD other than right after a wash. Can I actually use is if I just need to touch up with out washing, I assumed that would cause swirling if I did so.

What I got from what you are said with finish is that is I am going to polish I will need swirl and down other wise may not be worth the time/money. But use amigo is worth a go on its own.

I am glad you told me epic then BG because I would have probably done it the other way thinking the Epic would seal in the BG. It makes sense though to put the more stable on first.

As for the thin coat of Epic, I know what you mean the part you have to be the most patient comes when you are already tired. Sometimes I wait a few hours and keep the car covered until I can take the time I need to with a wax. I have also read there is benefit to multiple thin applications of Epic. Do you apply the next coat after the first has cured? How many coats is optimal.

Looks like I will be going with my first priority list still of Mystic, Epic, and Hydro to start.

Second priority: Swirl, Finish, Amigo, and BG.

Third installment: Nourish, Clarity, Slick

Is it worth trying to work with the polishers before getting a PC?

I am assuming Mystic will not strip Epic. When I do start using the polishers do I need to prep other than wash with mystic, in other words do I need to strip what I have first?

Where does claying fall in, between mystic and Epic I assume? Or Mystic, clay, Mystic, Epic?

How long do these products last? Sounds like Epic last a while since you use thin coast and only have to apply twice a year. Hydro probably goes fast. Other than that I have no idea.

The cost of getting the whole set is enormous, but it seems like once you have each one replacing one at a time isn't bad. I guess I will see if my dad wants to split a set since he also has a MINI.

[bee1000n]

Too many questions! You might want to call Detailers Paradise for more help. It might be easier to talk this out than to type it.

First order for general maintenance:

• Mystic to wash
• Hydro for light protection - I've found that applying Hydro after 2 car washes will give pretty good water beading. So long as you wash 2 or 3 times a month, you don't really need to apply a traditional wax.
• Slick to clean up from time to time (QD isn't wax, it's made to loosen dust from the finish so you can wipe it off with a buffing towel without inducing scratches or swirls)
• 4 waffle-weave microfiber drying towels
• 4 fluffy microfiber buffing towels

2nd order for more protection:

• Black Wow to keep your plastic trim black (or I like Adam's VRT or 303 Aerospace for interior and exterior trim - cheaper but don't last as long)
• Detailing clay (you do this before waxing to remove bonded contaminants from the finish)
• Epic - it will last up to 6 months in my experience
• BG if you want it
• something to apply the waxes with
• more towels

3rd order for paint correction:
*Very few people really do paint correction, despite the impression this forum gives you!*

• Porter-Cable polisher and pads
• Swirl
• Amigo
• more towels, you can always use more towels!

For glass, pick up a can of Invisible Glass at Pep Boys.

[BlimeyCabrio]

Originally Posted by mitch171

I am a little confused as to what the difference between a QD and a wax is I guess. I assumed a QD was a light wax, I have never used a QD other than right after a wash. Can I actually use is if I just need to touch up with out washing, I assumed that would cause swirling if I did so.

QD isn't a light wax. The purpose of QD is to provide lubrication and lifting properties to aid in the removal of dust, bugs, etc. between washes. You don't QD a "dirty" car - because the grit WILL swirl the paint. But if the car ONLY has light dust, plus some bug guts on the front, QD gives you a quick way of spiffing up the car without the need for a full wash & dry.

What I got from what you are said with finish is that is I am going to polish I will need swirl and down other wise may not be worth the time/money. But use amigo is worth a go on its own.

Exactly - Swirl is an effective swirl remover. Amigo is ALWAYS a good thing as the last step before sealant or wax - even when applied by hand if you don't have a PC yet.

I am glad you told me epic then BG because I would have probably done it the other way thinking the Epic would seal in the BG. It makes sense though to put the more stable on first.

It's not just that Epic is "more stable"... but you only put a synthetic sealant on CLEAN paint with no other wax... otherwise the sealant won't bond to the paint and you lose the benefit.

As for the thin coat of Epic, I know what you mean the part you have to be the most patient comes when you are already tired. Sometimes I wait a few hours and keep the car covered until I can take the time I need to with a wax. I have also read there is benefit to multiple thin applications of Epic. Do you apply the next coat after the first has cured? How many coats is optimal.

ONE coat of Epic is optimal, as long as you don't miss any spots. Some folks apply two light coats, just on the hope that the second coat will cover any spots they missed the first time. You don't end up with a "thicker" coat or additional protection, even if you apply it 100 times. Each coat effectively "removes" the previous coat...

Is it worth trying to work with the polishers before getting a PC?

In my opinion, no. The Prima polishes are made for using a dual-action polisher and foam pads. While they can be used by hand with *some* benefit, it's way too much work for the benefit you get.

Amigo is the exception - it's not a true polish, and it's filling and glaze properties can have benefits even when hand-applied.

I am assuming Mystic will not strip Epic. When I do start using the polishers do I need to prep other than wash with mystic, in other words do I need to strip what I have first?Where does claying fall in, between mystic and Epic I assume? Or Mystic, clay, Mystic, Epic?

Correct - Mystique does not strip Epic.
In my opinion, claying is all you need to do to strip prior to polishing. But some of the others here disagree with me on that, and they either do an alcohol wipe-down or use a specialized paint prep. In my opinion, claying and polishing is gonna remove everything that's on your paint, anyway - I believe the alcohol wipe-down is a harmless but useless step.

How long do these products last? Sounds like Epic last a while since you use thin coast and only have to apply twice a year. Hydro probably goes fast. Other than that I have no idea.

One advantage of these products over typical retail products is that they are very concentrated and you use them very sparingly. It takes a TINY amount of Epic to do a whole car, and a bottle can last for years. The mistake most folks make is they use way too much product - especially Hydro. With Hydro, you need a little spritz on each panel before you dry. You do NOT have to "cover" the paint with the product. That tiny spritz gets spread around by the towel while you dry. A bottle of Hydro can last MANY washes... but some folks go through half a bottle the first time... that's a big waste.

The polishes also last a long time... takes not much to do a MINI.

The cost of getting the whole set is enormous, but it seems like once you have each one replacing one at a time isn't bad. I guess I will see if my dad wants to split a set since he also has a MINI.

True... but you get what you pay for...

[mitch171]

Thank you for tackling my questions, I just start typing and keep asking lol.

I have microfiber so I don't need to get much of that at this point. I last summer I did a lot of detailing with the products available in places like autozone. I am wanting to take that next step and get some better product.

You are right on these forums I feel like I am doing a disservice to my MINI by not working with paint correction.

I have been using the invisible glass stuff, I just figured clarity was even better. Invisible glass does an amazing job. I did clay bar twice last summer with the kit available at WalMart. Twice because it was before application of some decals for my wedding and after they were taken off to get all the adhesive off. I loved the effect of claying it really brightened up my used MINI.

Thank you for all your help.

[mitch171]

Thank you for your response Blimey. I am going to add amigo to my first order list so I will have mystic, epic, hydro, amigo, and slick. My short list keeps getting long... That should keep me happy for a while. Maybe ask for a PC, pads and polish kit for B-day if I feel it needs to be done. PC and pads either way because it would make application of amigo and epic easier.

Thanks for all your help, keep the UJ's looking good I am in the process of adding more to mine.

[BlimeyCabrio]

Retail clay kits work just fine... there's nothing really *magic* about anybody's clay, IMHO.

Invisible Glass is good stuff. Lots of folks swear by it. I like the way Clarity cuts through "film"... but both are good products.

Another great product that I've just recently started using is Banana Gloss... as an alternative to Hydro, perhaps... you can wax the whole car in half a hour, and it looks FANTASTIC, even though it's been MANY months since my last Epic treatment.

[mitch171]

Originally Posted by BlimeyCabrio

Retail clay kits work just fine... there's nothing really *magic* about anybody's clay, IMHO.

Invisible Glass is good stuff. Lots of folks swear by it. I like the way Clarity cuts through "film"... but both are good products.

Another great product that I've just recently started using is Banana Gloss... as an alternative to Hydro, perhaps... you can wax the whole car in half a hour, and it looks FANTASTIC, even though it's been MANY months since my last Epic treatment.

If you use the invisible glass stuff I recommend applying it, let it sit for a bit like 30 sec and wipe off and then repeat. It gets through the film after two applications and is very cheap and available.

I was thinking about the BG and I have asked on another post is it is possible to apply hydro on top of BG. I think that might not be possible since BG has carnauba and hydro is synthetic. Right?

Btw "Blimey" looks awsome. When I am home I will post what I was able to do with retail store products to prep. "Oblio" for the wedding.

Anyway the plan I was thinking was Epic twice a year, BG four times and hydro after each wash. Maybe that is more than needed.

Does Does the wax have to be stripped before using Amigo. In other words I would only do the Amigo during the twice a year applications of Epic?

[BlimeyCabrio]

I use Hydro over BG as do other folks, no problems. The Hydro probably doesn't last as long that way, nor provide as much protection, but with the BG under it, it doesn't really need to. You're not talking a lot of carnauba in BG.... it's not like if you were applying Hydro on top of a traditional carnauba wax.

[MiniMaybee]

Originally Posted by BlimeyCabrio

...the alcohol wipe-down is a harmless but useless step...

I'm in to harmless as long as it's cheap. Useless? Like a gas pedal in a MINI.
I'd rather get all the previous wax off before I start to clay so it can focus on what I'm really wanting it to do. If I can remove my old wax with a little alcohol & water then my clay can better remove the bonded contaminates and peace and balance is restored to the world (mine anyway).
But yeah polish and clay will remove any wax on the paint.

[BlimeyCabrio]

Controversial, I know. We've had this conversation before.

I hope we can still be friends.

[MiniMaybee]

Well alrighty then.
We're only talking a few cents for product and like 15 minutes for my extra step so no biggie. Friends of course as long as you agree that I'm right.

[BlimeyCabrio]

And the real craziness is, I already have an industrial-sized bottle of isopropyl alcohol in the garage that I use for other things... So I've spent more time discussing this than I would actually have spent DOING it in the last year... I guess I should just shut up and be assimilated.

[MiniMaybee]

BTW Paul - I just ordered some of the Adam's Undercarriage Spray. Sounds like good stuff.

[mitch171]

I have done no searching on this topic so forgive me if I am an idiot.

We cover our cars with expensive product to prevent the paint from being exposed to harsh chemicals.

Alcohol dries out skin, hair, anything it touches, is a somewhat harsh chemical.

Should we put harsh chemicals on our paint, which is apparently so fragile that using a clean towel on a can'tevenseeit dust will prevent marks which will need to be polished out?

Again I am just thinking out loud I have no evidence or research to go on here.

[BlimeyCabrio]

Dilute alcohol, wiped on and evaporated, isn't gonna hurt your paint. Dust is an abrasive... that's what makes swirls... like you wouldn't want to dry off yourself with sandpaper after a shower, would you?

Your paint isn't *that* fragile... it's actually pretty tough to stand up to road debris, acid rain, etc....but because it has a glossy finish, it DOES show even tiny scratches easily... which is why you never want to wipe it with anything abrasive.

[mitch171]

Ya you are probably right that the alcohol would have no impact on the integrity of the paint. I just thought it was interesting to think about.

Women like to rub sandpaper on themselves under fancy terms like exfoliate. So maybe our MINIs need a good exfoliation. Just kidding!

[BlimeyCabrio]

Actually, that's what you're doing when you polish... sortof.

If your MINI had dead skin (clearcoat) you would absolutely sand it to fix that.

[mitch171]

Everyday I am further convinced my MINI is alive.

[k_h_d]

Slick on the windows works. I have stopped using slick though as IMHO its just too expensive for quick detailing. I really like Meguires Quick Detailer for quick detailing. It does a great job and is cheap. Hydro is still my after wash goto fast wax.