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If I was gonna do that, and didn't want to polish, I would:
* Black Wow FIRST
* Wash
* Clay (quick and easy)
* Hand application/removal of Amigo (also quick and easy)
* Epic
* Wait 24 hours for Epic to fully cure.
* QD with Hydro
Trust me and do it.
The Amigo makes a BIG difference... as does clay... as does letting the Epic cure before putting anything on top of it.
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If I was gonna do that, and didn't want to polish, I would:
* Black Wow FIRST
* Wash
* Clay (quick and easy)
* Hand application/removal of Amigo (also quick and easy)
* Epic
* Wait 24 hours for Epic to fully cure.
* QD with Hydro
Trust me and do it.
The Amigo makes a BIG difference... as does clay... as does letting the Epic cure before putting anything on top of it.
I didn't know you had to let it cure, so Thats a good thing to know.. Sonce I am getting a feeler I will go off the folks that have been doing it longer than I..
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I want to do a Spring re-coat of Epic and want to make sure I've got the pre-application process correct. I've read through threads but if there's anything I'm missing or wrong please let me know.
-Wash with Mystique
-spritz with 50% water/alcohol mixture (would I need to wipe the mixture after spritzing? If so what would I wipe with?) and rinse?
-wash again this time using Mystique (or Dawn?) as my lube for clay.
-Clay then rinse
*Do I need to wash after claying or just rinse?
-apply Epic
-stand back and be proud
Thanks for any input.
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No need to wash after clay since you will be wiping down each section as you go.
One note however, Mystique has polymers in it and is expensive. Use cheap soap like Gold Class to do your initial wash since you don't want to waste money and you'll just be stripping the polymers anyway. Also, I would go from the alcohol step straight to the clay using either diluted QD or or your Gold Class soap water.
Also consider using Amigo before Epic if you have some.
Thanks a lot for the info, good tip on using the Mystique.
So when I spritz the alcohol can I just apply it to an area, then clay with lube without wiping or doing anything else to the area?
I hadn't thought about Amigo, I'll look into that.
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What the alcohol does is breaks the polymer chains which are linked together & intertwined to form the protective wax layer. Once they are broken there is no putting them back. So no need to do anything after using the alcohol. It will dry fast enough that when you have done the whole car the first part should be dry and ready to clay.
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So, if one already has Epic on the car, and one is claying and polishing and/or Amigo-ing... is there REALLY any benefit to also doing the alcohol wipe? Seems to me that you're not going to have any Epic left on the car, anyway... and if you did, so what?
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I think there are varying opinions whether clay removes wax or not. Assume not and you're out like $0.02 for alcohol. Yup, polish will remove Epic and so will Amigo since it has cleaners in it, but the alcohol step is painless, takes no time and cost nothing so why not? It is just one additional cleaning step on your path to perfection Blimeysan.
The Alcohol wipe is a good idea--though I don't do it. Two really good Dawn washes and an orbital will kill any existing wax protection. Like Chuck said, I use Mystique for maintenance washes--washes where I'm not waxing or polishing--just washing the MINI and want the paint to look its best. For prepping for machine polishing, the cheapest stuff is fine since you will obliterate any positive "finishing" qualities of that soap once you get down to work.
I really think the "Ryan" sticky on claying needs to be removed--it's misleading to so many people who think they need to wash a second time after claying. There's definitely some good info in it, but it's certainly not current.
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So, if one already has Epic on the car, and one is claying and polishing and/or Amigo-ing... is there REALLY any benefit to also doing the alcohol wipe? Seems to me that you're not going to have any Epic left on the car, anyway... and if you did, so what?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiniMaybee
I think there are varying opinions whether clay removes wax or not. Assume not and you're out like $0.02 for alcohol. Yup, polish will remove Epic and so will Amigo since it has cleaners in it, but the alcohol step is painless, takes no time and cost nothing so why not? It is just one additional cleaning step on your path to perfection Blimeysan.
Good question and good answer, IMO. Here are some additional/complementary thoughts...
Certainly a thorough abrasive polish will remove any durable synthetic wax (ie Epic) simply because the process removes a fine layer of paint (which would of course include any wax on top of the paint!).
Depending on how much of a durable synthetic wax (ie Epic) is left on the paint at the time, it's possible that a good paint cleanser polish (like Amigo) will remove what wax is left.
Claying almost always removes all or much of a durable synthetic wax (ie Epic) but not always and not always completely- it depends on a number of factors including how much of the wax may be still on the paint at the time.
SO, taking these above 3 points into consideration, you can see that although any of the above steps (abrading, cleansing, claying) may and in many cases will remove your durable synthetic wax, each has a "it depends" clause.
This is why MiniMaybee makes his point about how you might as well do the alcohol step anyway to be certain you've removed it. It's fairly quick and easy and certainly is inexpensive.
Personally though... If I abrade I don't bother with an alcohol step. If I clay I usually don't bother with an alcohol step. If I cleanse (ie,non-abrasive polish like Amigo) then I might do the alcohol step. I definitely do an alcohol step if I am switching waxes. In other words, if the last wax I used was Zaino and I'm switching to Epic, then I will do an alcohol step.
All that said though, keep in mind that you don't always need to remove your existing durable synthetic wax before you re-apply it.
There are really just 2 main reasons I can think of as to why you might do an alcohol step as a preparation for a synthetic wax:
1) You're switching wax types or brands, etc. and you want to make sure all of the old wax has been removed before applying the new wax. -Or-
2) Your personality is such that you just like the feeling of knowing that you are working with a completely clean slate and thus know without a doubt that you will achieve the maximum durability from your wax application. (you know who you are out there! )
The other steps: claying, abrasive polishing, cleansing polishing, etc. are often necessary anyway but shouldn't be thought of specifically as a means of removing your old wax. Each may happen to help you remove your old wax as a by-product of the process, which may in turn be exactly what you wanted to do anyway: remove your old wax.
So I would recommend assessing whether or not you need to clay, abrade or cleanse independently of your wax removal issue.
Then, decide whether or not you need to worry about how much or all of your old wax has been removed (read: are you switching waxes or do you just like to add an extra steps so you can have that feeling of definite purity?).
Clear as mud?? (this is one of those times I hope I'm helping to clarify but I'm not sure if I just made it worse!)
The other point I wanted to make is about the order of operations regarding an alcohol step...
If you do an alcohol step, you will get the most from the process if you do it right before your wax step (or right before your Amigo step, if you're using Amigo).
Doing it earlier does help but you might as well wait until the final wax (or Amigo) moment so you really have the most squeaky clean you can get.
It's a subtle difference, but I know you OCDers out there are all about the subtle differences! So, this slight variation in process order is especially beneficial to those who do the alcohol step mostly just for that feeling of pure clean!
I want to do a Spring re-coat of Epic and want to make sure I've got the pre-application process correct. I've read through threads but if there's anything I'm missing or wrong please let me know.
-Wash with Mystique
-spritz with 50% water/alcohol mixture (would I need to wipe the mixture after spritzing? If so what would I wipe with?) and rinse?
-wash again this time using Mystique (or Dawn?) as my lube for clay.
-Clay then rinse
*Do I need to wash after claying or just rinse?
-apply Epic
-stand back and be proud
Thanks for any input.
Using your original question format, I'll summarize my suggested process
(which also integrates what many others have already narrated as well):
-Wash with any old soap (Dawn or any non-polymer soap) THIS TIME ONLY (then use Mystique for all subsequent washes)
-Clay using a spray bottle of clay lubricant or a mix of water and car wash soap (just a few drops of the soap) For clay instructions, click HERE.
-IF you are switching waxes or just really like to be super-duper anal-retentive then spritz the car with a 50/50 water-alcohol mixture. (wipe each section as you go with a microfiber cloth to remove the old wax, etc. as you go... spritz and wipe, spritz and wipe, and so on)
-apply Epic
-stand back and be proud
Especially since you're claying anyway, an Amigo step would be optional, IMO, for Pepper White. However, it would definitely benefit your black roof. So, you could go either way. *Just make sure that if you use Amigo and do the alcohol step that you do the alcohol step before you use Amigo or the alcohol will clean off all the filling/concealing benefits of Amigo!
