Orange Peel

[TheBigNewt]

I'm new to detailing. The last thing I did was wash (ICE), clay (Mothers), and wax (ICE, I like how I can use it on the wheel arches and there's no haze). I use some Hydro every other wash or so with a WW towel from DP. But when I heard the term "orange peel", I can see some of that in my (new) paint. Is that just a reality of new paint? Can I get rid of that, or should I with a new car? The car looks great I think, but the orange peel makes me wonder.

[ScottRiqui]

Orange peel is a fact of life with any factory finish. Some cars have more than others, some colours show it more than others, and it will show up more on some parts of your car than other parts, but it's always there.

You can't get rid of it with waxes or sealants, because the maximum thickness of material that waxes and sealants leave behind isn't thick enough to "level out" the factory clearcoat.

The only way to get rid of it is to wet-sand the paint, and then buff/polish it back to a shine. I don't recommend it for a daily-driver, because you're going to be removing a significant portion of your clearcoat. Also, unless you have some experience with wet-sanding, and a lot of patience, the odds of successfully wet-sanding your entire car without messing up *somewhere* and going all the way through the clearcoat are just about zero.

You *could* have a good body shop apply another layer of clearcoat to your car, and then have them wetsand and polish it out. This would leave you with the same (or greater) clearcoat thickness than you started with, but it can be expensive, and they have to make sure the paint is *absolutely* clean before applying the new clear. Any leftover wax in a crevice, or traces of silicone-based dressing anywhere on the paint, will cause adhesion/flow problems in the new clear.

[FranticFreddy]

Where do you see the "orange peel"?

[MINIFVR]

Wait, I thought I read somewhere that clay took care of some or all of orange peel???

[MLPearson79]

My whole car is orange-peeled, pretty much. The places it's most noticible to me are on the door panels, when I look down the side at them.

And no, clay doesn't do anything to orange peel. Orange peel is a lack of levelness to the clear coat (think like, golf ball surface or something). The only way to fix is to either fill it w/more clear coat and level it by sanding/polishing (as mentioned above) or sand down the clear coat to level it (not good for a car that's driven regularly). Clay just picks up things that are embedded in the top surface of clear coat.

[pdflint]

The amount of orange peel depends on how the paint was atomized when it was applied and how the paint was formulated. Environmental regulations limit the solvents that can be used to make and reduce the coating. Most OEM finishes are applied with sophisticated automatic equipment and must be baked in an oven to cure. Most automakers build in a level of orange peel becuase it increases apparent gloss and because it helps hide minor surface imperfections.

Orange peel cannot be removed by normal polishing. The finish must be wet sanded and then polished. Improper wet sanding could easily wear through the clear coat to the base coat, which is not a good thing. This is a task best left to the professionals.

[jwardell]

It's a BMW paint thing, and common on plenty of other brands as well. I see it pretty bad on cars twice as expensive.

After an accident one side of my car was repainted with no orange peel at all, and that's a big reason why I say they made it better than new!

[TheBigNewt]

I don't think it really detracts from the looks of the freshly clayed/ICEd car, but I can see it. You explained it well, thanks. I'll not concern myself with it and place an order to DP for some more goodies during their 3 days sale!

[kenchan]

if your car is a daily driven car most definitely keep your orange peel.
why? cause from a PDR perspective, it's easier to hide the ding's final
imperfection in the orange peel than on a glass smooth finish panel.

it will come out more natural.

[Detailers Paradise]

Originally Posted by ScottRiqui

Orange peel is a fact of life with any factory finish. Some cars have more than others, some colours show it more than others, and it will show up more on some parts of your car than other parts, but it's always there.

You can't get rid of it with waxes or sealants, because the maximum thickness of material that waxes and sealants leave behind isn't thick enough to "level out" the factory clearcoat.

The only way to get rid of it is to wet-sand the paint, and then buff/polish it back to a shine. I don't recommend it for a daily-driver, because you're going to be removing a significant portion of your clearcoat. Also, unless you have some experience with wet-sanding, and a lot of patience, the odds of successfully wet-sanding your entire car without messing up *somewhere* and going all the way through the clearcoat are just about zero.

You *could* have a good body shop apply another layer of clearcoat to your car, and then have them wetsand and polish it out. This would leave you with the same (or greater) clearcoat thickness than you started with, but it can be expensive, and they have to make sure the paint is *absolutely* clean before applying the new clear. Any leftover wax in a crevice, or traces of silicone-based dressing anywhere on the paint, will cause adhesion/flow problems in the new clear.

Originally Posted by pdflint

The amount of orange peel depends on how the paint was atomized when it was applied and how the paint was formulated. Environmental regulations limit the solvents that can be used to make and reduce the coating. Most OEM finishes are applied with sophisticated automatic equipment and must be baked in an oven to cure. Most automakers build in a level of orange peel becuase it increases apparent gloss and because it helps hide minor surface imperfections.

Orange peel cannot be removed by normal polishing. The finish must be wet sanded and then polished. Improper wet sanding could easily wear through the clear coat to the base coat, which is not a good thing. This is a task best left to the professionals.

These are both such excellent explanations of orange peel! I hadn't heard of the environmental regulations and solvents part, but it certainly makes sense these days.

Orange peel can also be caused by incorrect temperatures during application and incorrect dry times/environments.
Whatever the cause, it results in the paint droplets drying out into little bumps before they have a chance to meld together and level out to a smooth surface.

Ultimately though, most agree that many automakers add orange peel imperfections on purpose... as a way to hide other kinds of imperfections. It sounds strange but it's true and unfortunate.

-Heather

[Detailers Paradise]

Originally Posted by jwardell

It's a BMW paint thing, and common on plenty of other brands as well. I see it pretty bad on cars twice as expensive.

I totally agree. BMW is the classic example these days of orange peel. You simply cannot find a BMW anymore that does not have a good bit of orange peel! Others have it too, but BMW leads the pack.

-Heather