Why 3000 rpm at 75 mph?
#1
Why 3000 rpm at 75 mph?
Both the MC and MCS operate comfortably at 2000 rpm. So, why can't the gearing be set to allow 75 mph at 2000 or 2500 rpm in sixth?
Wouldn't it save on drive train wear and boost fuel economy?
Is the gearing physically impossible? Or what?
Thanks for your thoughts.
Wouldn't it save on drive train wear and boost fuel economy?
Is the gearing physically impossible? Or what?
Thanks for your thoughts.
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#8
#9
I'm guessing the problem is as much one of "which 6 gears would you like to have"? You can have a close ratio gearbox that keeps the engine in it's power band as you accelerate, or a wide ratio box that pulls stumps and idles down the freeway, but the only way to have both is to add more gears. Personally, I'd love to have a 7th gear in our '05 JCW so the rpm's dropped a bit at highway speeds and mileage improved, but I'm no losing sleep over it.
Alan
Alan
#10
Torque is good for changing speed, but you need hp to overcome drag, and hp increases with rpm. I don't know how much hp is needed to push a MINI through the air at 75, but I don't find 2000 rpm gives me the driving characteristics I'm comfortable with unless going down hill. I like the way my MCS responds from 2,500 rpm at moderate speeds, and 3,000 rpm at higher speeds.
#11
Interesting observation......
In my '09 Clubman with the auto trans, it's running at 2500 at 70, compared to my '03 which is turning 3k at 70 (stick), seems like the auto box would have more trouble but it seems to pull that up hills with no effort.
My Audi allroad which has the twin turbo V-6 also runs right at 3K at 70, and I know it has more than enough poke to pull a taller gear. Must be a German thing............
In my '09 Clubman with the auto trans, it's running at 2500 at 70, compared to my '03 which is turning 3k at 70 (stick), seems like the auto box would have more trouble but it seems to pull that up hills with no effort.
My Audi allroad which has the twin turbo V-6 also runs right at 3K at 70, and I know it has more than enough poke to pull a taller gear. Must be a German thing............
#12
The gearing is already quite high (ie revs low at high speed) compared to the average European small car with a small engine.
The gearing in the S is actually pretty well matched to the engine, top speed is reached when the engine is revving a little the other side of the torque peak, but before the torque really starts to fall off. That'll give you the highest max speed.
The MC is really quite over geared. Top speed is just past the torque peak in 5th, and 6th is just an over drive.
Americans with big lazy engines are just used to different ways of doing it. The MINI was rationally designed by Germans. Though I'b be quite happy if 6th were a little taller in the S, make it more of an overdrive cuising gear. Its a bit close to 5th, making 5th pretty redundant in most cases (unless you're driving at about 120mph+.)
The gearing in the S is actually pretty well matched to the engine, top speed is reached when the engine is revving a little the other side of the torque peak, but before the torque really starts to fall off. That'll give you the highest max speed.
The MC is really quite over geared. Top speed is just past the torque peak in 5th, and 6th is just an over drive.
Americans with big lazy engines are just used to different ways of doing it. The MINI was rationally designed by Germans. Though I'b be quite happy if 6th were a little taller in the S, make it more of an overdrive cuising gear. Its a bit close to 5th, making 5th pretty redundant in most cases (unless you're driving at about 120mph+.)
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I'm guessing the problem is as much one of "which 6 gears would you like to have"? You can have a close ratio gearbox that keeps the engine in it's power band as you accelerate, or a wide ratio box that pulls stumps and idles down the freeway, but the only way to have both is to add more gears. Personally, I'd love to have a 7th gear in our '05 JCW so the rpm's dropped a bit at highway speeds and mileage improved, but I'm no losing sleep over it.
Alan
Alan
#16
The way the sequence is set up, fifth is too close to sixth, and irrelevant. Generally, I go directly from 4th to 6th. I'd prefer to jump to a higher "overdrive" gear.
#17
My justaclubman auto is pretty dead below 3000. I have a hilly headwind on the way home from work (280 nb in SF bay area) and I have to shift to 5th and sometime 4th to get it maintain speed. at 2 grand forgetboutit!
Over 3000 it moves out smartly but the 4 cylinder boom at 3800 is annoying.
also my 3000 is close to 81 mph on my car, giving it a 5% error that is still 77 not 75.
Also I am rarely below 70 on the freeway and it feels better at 85 in 6th than below 80.
Over 3000 it moves out smartly but the 4 cylinder boom at 3800 is annoying.
also my 3000 is close to 81 mph on my car, giving it a 5% error that is still 77 not 75.
Also I am rarely below 70 on the freeway and it feels better at 85 in 6th than below 80.
#18
Hi Oldsbear, they sure are geared low, you`re correct . This is done to help keep things on-the-boil. My old x-race Neon Supersport was geared to the moon, redline in top worked out to an impossible 180+MPH! And gave a peaceful 1800 rpm cruse at 60mph. This also meant that you didn`t need to shift nearly as often due to the resulting wide gear spacing. No it didn`t seem to have much low end pull. Your Mini pulls way better than such a small engine should, the low gearing helping it mimic a close ratio transmission.
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Actually, it gets better than that. Sixth gear at 45 mph gets me into the 50 mpg range.
However, the great fuel economy would come at the cost of road rage wrecks that would occur. There's also the issue of going to sleep at the wheel.
However, the great fuel economy would come at the cost of road rage wrecks that would occur. There's also the issue of going to sleep at the wheel.
#21
Some of you would obviously like one of the early VW five-speed gearboxes. They fitted what would now be normal close-ratio boxes to the higher performance models like the GTI, but the real economy versions had a wide-ratio box that was called 4+E and was actually marked 1,2,3,4,E on the ****. 4 was the same as in a four-speed box and then E was a really long cruising ratio above that. Maximum speed was definitely in fourth. Presumably folk didn't like it, because it was dropped pretty quickly. I drove a Polo (smaller than a Golf/Rabbit) with one and it was certainly annoying on a motorway that you had to change down from E to 4 for really quite shallow gradients.
Andrew
Andrew
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